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With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!
Drat. I was looking for the version that goes
"...Gloria's unfree
Wheeze tendon guard
Wheeze tendon guard fore thee..."
and it's not findable by me. Foof.
*With glowing hearts we see thee rise,*
*The True North strong and free!*
And where it's not free, 7% GST (6% after July 1, assuming the retailers can figure out Revenue Canada's regulations on their own.)
Plus provincial sales tax. Which Alberta doesn't have! (Hint, hint.)
Question for the gardeners out there...would mint work as a groundcover for full sun areasin central Az-I'm looking for something that will inhibit the Bermuda Grass growth.
An employee of a home-improvement place suggested this,but i remain dubious.
Which mint? Some are more robust than others. Plain old spear mint and horsemint and bog mint are tough. Peppermint or any of the fancy mints are tender.
Lemon balm falls into the invade if happy group.
Only if mint is all that you want in your garden. And all that your neighbors want in their gardens. It will romp all over the place, but not necessarily crowd out the Bermuda grass. Mint is notorious as an aggressive spreader.
Mint also likes partial shade, but around here grows in full sun (the Willamette Valley being the peppermint oil capital of the world, or so I'm told, and don't the air smell pretty whey they cut it?)
Want some more ideas? Try the You Grow Girl forums at http://www.yougrowgirl.com/
For the love of Ghu, do not plant mint unless you want mint galore. I've had a 'bloom' happen with Lemon Balm, plain old mint, and catnip. And it's just about impossible to remove once it gets going. Even a couple of the Mediterranean herbs are also invasive... I had a thyme jump from a planter bloc between house and sidewalk out into the yard, obviously following the Lemon Balm that had already made the escape.
The climate and rainfall here in KC, MO are most excellent for such things, the only reason we do not have mint in the planter area directly in front of my porch is because it was rototilled three times AFTER the mint got a good start (we did it shallow enough that the tulips that were there were unharmed, and I'm gettinig ready to plant some Dahlia and Daffodil bulbs in it...)
"Travel plans, Patrick?"
My only immediate travel plans involve the annual gathering of the American Library Association in New Orleans.
Which is in fact a strange not-quite-American place with lots of vestigial French, but a different one.
Is there some special reason to celebrate Canada at the moment? Did I miss something?
Apropos of don't plant mint unless you want a lot of it -- same goes for rosemary.
Hello?! Sixty-seven!?
Okay, maybe we should have held off until July 1. But JEEZ.
Rosemary out where you are, Lizzy; out here, I'm proud that my one bush thrives.
Nina, I'm living in a different climate, but you might want to look at my gardening posts from last year, when the mint I'd used as a ground cover romped all over the garden, throttling lesser plants.
Oregano will take on all comers. In many parts of the country, so will daylilies. IIRC, African daisies do very well in Arizona.
Whatever you do, don't plant oleander. Not even in a planter. It'll escape, you'll never be rid of it, and ever part of the damned plant is poisonous.
How about dichondra? When I was living in AZ, it was the non-grass of choice to crowd out bermuda grass. Slow growing, though.
I'd not recommend mint to try and crowd out bermuda grass. "The winner would emerge stronger than either, and free from doubt."
Okay, okay, dork alert. Sorry, Canada. Happy Independence Day. Why not get an early start?
Teresa, out here Caltrans (California Dept. of Transportation) plants oleander shrubs to decorate the freeways. It - the oleander - seems to be incredibly hardy, and rather lovely looking.
I had a deadly nightshade plant in my backyard in Berkeley. Big trumpet-shaped blossoms, and they smelled wonderful.
Thanks-basically this would be to cover the non-cement portions of the backyard-there isn't anything other than bermuda-oh,and some dandelions. we've already got an oleander hedge in the front-I'd get rid of it if i could teresa-but the neighbor whose property it borders-likes-it. Gah.
Will rethink the mint though.
We stand on guard for thee!
Happy early Canada Day and early Independence Day!
I'm hoping to make it to Brooklyn for the annual Canada Day concert in Prospect Park.
Lizzy L: and you can use the berries to make flying ointment. Careful with it though. It's bloody dangerous.
PNH said: My only immediate travel plans involve the annual gathering of the American Library Association in New Orleans.
Which is in fact a strange not-quite-American place with lots of vestigial French, but a different one.
Yeah, but the vestigial French came from Canada!
I had a deadly nightshade plant in my backyard in Berkeley. Big trumpet-shaped blossoms, and they smelled wonderful.
Deadly, quite possibly; nightshade, I don't think. Sounds like a Datura connection (I forget the current genus assignment of the popular ornamental forms).
It's my considered opinion that nothing can outgrow bermuda; all the other things discussed require more water than it does, for one thing.
There are Datura and Brugmansia (I think that's the spelling) which have lovely huge poisonous fragrant I think generally trumpet flowers. I think that they are members of the nightshade family.
The nightshade family is interesting--it includes some of the most commonly grown, both in home gardens and commercial horticulture, edible species -- tomatoes, potatos, bell peppers and chili peppers, eggplant--pluse one of the varieties of plant called huckleberry, and some other less well-known edibles including some referred to as "solanum." It also includes a number of poisonous species, including deadly nightshade, daturas, brugmansias, etc., and edible species with poisonous parts--non-fruit parts of tomato plants, the (usually not present) fruit of the potato.
As for spreading oregano, oh wow does it ever spread. I have spearmint in my year, chocolate mint dies out, apple mint manages to barely survive, and some other mints, but the oregano is extremely agressive. On the other hand, butterflies adore it, and it also attracts some dragonflies. Then there are the however many species of bees that come to visit--honeybees (apparently the town I live in, according to the Boston Globe, has a commercial beekeeping operation which delivers rent-a-hives over a rather wide area, for crop pollination), bumblebees, and other insects that look like bees but don't look to me like either bumblebees or honeybees.
What's amazing is watching butterflies and bees boucing off one another, it doesn't seem to faze them --the bees or the butterflies--at all! There will be a butterfly on a flowerhead (particularly the flowerhead on oregano...) and along comes a bee, heading for the flowerhead, with the butterfly in the way. BOING! Bee flys into butterfly and bounces off, barely noticed by the butterfly. Or, two bees will collide and bounce off one another, or there will be a butterfly-butterfly collison...
protégera nos foyers et nos droits
My planters are on a balcony several stories up. Mint will only invade if I let it (I am considering carefully), the sage died horribly, and my oregano doubled in size last week. Gardening is an awfully big adventure.
Must find tomatoes, and soon.
True north... as opposed to magnetic north. I've been north of magnetic north. There are warnings on maps of Greenland to not use magnetic compass headings looking for "north."
Speaking of Canada, I will be leaving my Toronto home in six weeks for a two year teaching engagement in Ghana. Has anyone here ever been to Ghana? Any interesting stories you'd like to tell?
I was just about to begin my quest for an agent before I got the job (if any of you read Miss Snark...that was me). Sigh.
cmk: yes, it was Datura. I just like to be able to say I had deadly nightshade in my garden. A freeze killed it. But it was wonderfully fragrant. Right now I have a lot of rosemary, sage, lavendar, a persimmon tree, a plum tree, and joy of joys, a blueberry bush which everyone tells me should not be giving me blueberries... but it does, every year. Oh, and a very sad tree which bears tiny dark rocks instead of nectarines...
Car ton bras sait porter l'épée
Il sait porter la croix
I can't remember the schoolkids version that involved bad jokes about bras making you cross - but there's definitely some joy in being able to make cross-language puns[0].
[0] Ah - menage a trois - the three of us need to clean house before the party.
Speaking of stretching your bras making you cross, I've been looking at various pilates reformers, and can't bring myself to spend several thousand dollars on the professional versions.
Does anybody have suggestions/knowledge about the more reasonably priced versions (I know you can do a lot without needing any equipment - but there are some exercises that really do better that way)
There's nightshade growing spreading in my yard, vining plants with horizontally spreading roots, plants that smell something like bell peppers, and have green leaves that look like mutated bell pepper plant leaves--they have lobes to them instead of being simple teardrop shapes.
having lived in canada for the past three years, & attended my share of junior hockey games, i can assure you that the correct lyrics are "we stand on god for thee."
which gives one some insight into the canadian character (one, i imagine, not me).
Happy countdown to Canada day week!
A sfnalish question:
What short phrases could be used to set off a science fiction reader's SF-radar? i.e. dog-whistle (zogg-whistle?) words for SF-reader fandom: phrases which make sense to an entire audience, but also show that the speaker reads SF.
This is orthogonal to fanspeak. Dropping smof and tanj into regular conversation would set off a fan's fendar, but would also sound like gibberish to everyone else. Good if you need passwords for when fandom saves the world from repressive governments. Bad if all you want to do is obliquely ask if anyone else in the audience reads SF.
Of course, one could simply ask the audience. But there's no challenge in that.
I'd been wondering more about "could fanspeak exist which would be understood by SF readers even if they know nothing about fandom? What would it be?" [because, checking fan jargon lists, it doesn't exist now.]
Describing bad weather as "the color of a dead ipod screen." The phrase "In 5 years the X will be obsolete." Saying "I read both Ian Banks."
xeger - good gravy! Are those army surplus items from Guantanamo? Gives reform school a bad name.
Mint can be contained by planting it in a submerged pot. Or so I hear - I have not done so myself.
I wish my oregano would spread - the sage is taking it over. The thyme is losing the battle with the ivy, and the rosemary is thinking of world conquest.
I have Vietnamese cilantro duking it out next to peppermint, and the two seem to be evenly matched.
The chives, however, look to be seriously intimidated.
We had dichondra in Westwood (LA), and it was a dandy groundcover.
Seems to me that I used to see cotton fields in central Az, especially driving up US 89-93 rather than I-10. Find a plant which likes the same growing conditions, maybe?
Pennyroyal, from the mint family but more pest repelant.
Linkmeister-
The growing conditions for cotton in Arizona (and in California's central valley) are "heavily irrigated with cheap water."
Nina-
Do you have Sunset's Western Garden Guide? Sunset includes the southwest, so it should have useful ideas.
Happy be thee, O Canada!
<open thread>I haven't found any news about it on the International Astronomical Union site, but there's some news circulating (orbiting? rotating?) in other places about distant sol-orbiting bodies which may or may not be planets and moons.
With so much going wrong around me (& hearing about more elsewhere), sometimes it's nice to consider stuff like this that's quite outside those considerations. Not so sure about this kind of news.</open thread>
Sometimes you get a slightly different view of Beowulf. It does rather look still to be one of those living stories, when you can see something like this bit of street-theatre.
Photographs by my brother.
Never, ever, ever plant Japanese knotweed. After efforts involving gallons of undiluted "total vegetation killer" (which isn't), a bulldozer, and other weapons of mass plant destruction, I still have not managed to eradicate all the spawn of a single plant. The War Upon the Knotweed will celebrate its seventh anniversary in a month or so with no end in sight.
I didn't actually put this in the ground myself - it's technically The War Upon the Neighbor's Knotweed. There were guerilla expeditions Over the Fence armed with poisons and weapons of clipping and chopping before The Day the Bulldozer Came and I had my own "Mission Accomplished" celebration, which was about as valid as Dubya's.
I'm told it's edible, so if anyone is feeling peckish, come by for some green stuff.
Kathryn in Sunnyvale: One possibility that springs to my mind would be to work in the phrase, "Life, the Universe, and Everything."
(waves hi from Oakland)
I love the idea of having one's "fendar" set off, btw. Haven't heard of "fendar" before. I fear mine isn't very good. I seem to meet all sorts of people who set off my heretofore unbeknownst to me fendar, but who turn out to be not involved in sf or fandom in any way. Guess I've got the gain up a little too high.
There are three problems with glyphosate.
1: You have to get enough into the plant. The standard domestic pre-mix products may not have the same adjuvants as are available to farmers to boost the ability of the chemical to, for instance, penetrate waxey leaves.
2: It works by subverting biochemical pathways, so that the actively growing plant starts poisoning itself. Drought conditions slow the plant's growth, and the glyphosate doesn't work.
3: There's a genetic mutation which can make a plant more tolerant to the herbicide. This happens naturally, but Monsanto have a patent on its use in crops.
The upside is that glyphosate is one of the safer herbicides, if you're not a plant.
Lizzy, "Happy Independence Day"? It's Canada Day. We celebrate the entry into force of the British North America Act of 1867, which made Canada many things, but not independent. Canada didn't even have citizens until 1947. We only became fully independent of Westminster in 1982, when the provinces lost the right to take constitutional disputes to London and the process of amending Canada's basic law was vested fully in Canada.
We have no "Independence Day." "Independence" in Canada implies Quebec nationalism.
The Fête Nationale du Québec starts tomorrow though. The culturally correct way of celebrating it is to go downtown to the see the parade in the morning, and then get thoroughly drunk and spend the rest of the day singing drinking songs in French.
Lord: Oh, Northern boy
Clean of limb, clear of eye
Unfettered he lives, unfettered he'll die
The Northern boy
Oh Northern boy
Saskatchewan
An endless prairie
Where the buffalo used to roam
Devil: Only a man
Half blind on whisky
Would choose to make
This land his home
Would choose to make
This land his home
And "Canada Day" (July 1) was formerly known as "Dominion Day," celebrating the formation of the Dominion of Canada on July 1, 1867.
I'm unclear as to whether the name "The Dominion of Canada" is in any way still current; and if it isn't, when it changed and why.
Kathryn in Sunnyvale: Casual references to Superman or X-men might work.
Sunnyvale. Where have I heard about that place before. Do you have a hell-mouth or something under the library? Or was that Sunnydale?
Lizzy -- Sorry that Datura isn't even close to deadly nightshade (which makes your hands stink when you pull it.) But you could, with a clear conscience, say you're growing locoweed. ("Jimsonweed" doesn't quite have the same ring.) I think several parts of the plant are hallucinogens -- and poisonous, to boot. I remember reading a whodunnit where kids were hallucinating and dying because someone put ground datura seed in the instant coffee at a drop-in center.
Kathryn in Sunnyvale:
At work a few weeks ago I heard someone use the phrase "for no adequately explored reason" in a non-SF context, and that was enough to set off my Hitch-Hiker radar. (It's in The Restaurant at the End of the Universe.) I remember that two of the top three Google hits for the phrase were from Doctor Who reviews, so the words have evidently spread into fandom.
Nina, creeping thyme might be a better bet--it spreads slowly and likes full sun.
We have a lovely Brugmansia at the State Botanical Garden of Georgia--this shot is taken looking straight up. The plant is pollinated by bats.
Seems like a high concentration of gardners here, so I'll ask a related question. I live in an apartment with no balcony but a fairly good eastern exposure and lots of daylight. I'd like to grow some fresh cooking herbs (thyme, oregano, etc.) but I have no idea of it's practical. Anyone know a good source of information (online or in print) for growing herbs indoors?
Tom, here's a pretty good basic rundown. I would add to this only that overwatering kills more plants than underwatering. Drainage, as the man says in the article, is key.
I'd advise you to start with oregano. Given enough light, it is damn near foolproof.
I remember learning the Canadian national anthem in English and French in kindergarten.
Later, as my french got better, I pondered the lines:
Et ta valeur, de foi trempée,
Protegera nos foyers et nos droits...
Since I had only ever heard it phonetically, I kept thinking that it was foie trempée, and wondering what wet liver had to do with anything.
ALA in New Orleans? Man, now I'm doubly disappointed that I can't go this year, having become a Real Librarian a month and a half ago...
Xopher:
QVC (the least objectionable of the home shopping channels, imo) sells official Pilates machines for considerably less than $1K(comparison list here)
My PT claims that the Total Gym (as advertised by Chuck Norris, et al) will work for many Pilates exercises. I've never tried it, though (by the time I'd recovered enough from back surgery to try it, they'd rearranged the clinic and the TG was back in the therapy area rather than out on the gym floor).
Kathryn in Sunnyvale:
The number 42. References to the Infinite Probability Drive, Vogon poetry, or hyperspace bypasses.
The word 'grok'.
My friend Gort says 'Klatu Verata Nictu' but that's actually from a movie, and I'm not sure how to work it into a casual conversation.
Speaking of plants out of control, I have a weird plant that's taking over my side yard. I bought it at a gardening shop so many years ago that I lost the tag, and brought it with me when I moved four years ago. It must like my new place much better than the old, because instead of a single, steadfast plant it has become an invading army (with an impressive advance scouting capability) and now I really wish I remembered what it was.
It gets about 8-10' tall, is a single stem that in cross-section is a perfect square. The leaves are dark green and pointy (and big), and it makes little yellow flowers in mid-summer that are somewhat like black-eyed susans except no fuzzy center. The butterflies and hummingbirds adore these things.
Anyone have any ideas? I can try to get a photo at lunchtime if that'll help. Or if anyone wants one and can get to western Massachusetts, I've got plenty to spare...
I'm rather convinced that it'll eventually come down to a war between these things and Cthulhu the Wisteria for control of the side yard; the mint's not got a chance.
Err... that should have been 'Infinite Improbability Drive'.
How embarrassing.
I've used "tanj" as a cussword for years, and I've gotten a few glints of amusement for it, too. I'm sure I'll think of more once I've finished this nice fresh cup of really hot tea.
"Large Friendly Letters" might work also. A lot of non-fen have met Hitchhiker.
"Silver Falls" dichondra is sold for use in baskets and planters, but after it escapes over the side it will become a groundcover. Likes sun - it needs sun to stay silver - and relatively drought-tolerant.
Kathryn in Sunnyvale: What short phrases could be used to set off a science fiction reader's SF-radar? [..] phrases which make sense to an entire audience, but also show that the speaker reads SF.
During the 2004 presidential season, I saw Carol Mosley Braun on The Daily Show ( running to be nominated as the Democratic presidential candidate ). Talking about Bushian fear-mongering, she offered "Fear is the mindkiller". This made perfect sense in the context of the discussion, but obviously would resonate with anyone who had read Dune.
Later in the interview, she also said "Live long and prosper", which even non-SF people are going to recognize as an SF reference.
Her appearance on The Daily Show had been the day before she withdrew from the race. Stewart had fun with that the next day, after he had coaxed a promise from her during the interview to keep him and his audience up to date with her campaign's progress ( Paraphrase: "Whuhh? This wasn't worth mentioning?" ). I figured she delayed her withdrawl from the race, so she wouldn't have to cancel her TDS appearance.
Shouldn't this thread have been deferred until 1 July?
Scott, and all others of my northern neighbbors posting/lurking here, profound apologies. Happy Canada Day. Just don't wish me a Happy 4th of July in return: I'm not feeling especially happy about my country lately. Well, actually it's my government that's pissing me off -- I believe that my country, despite her grave flaws and her current troubles, "stands as she stood, rock-bottomed and coppered-sheathed", pace Dan'l Webster.
I don't get drunk any more, and I don't know any French drinking songs. I can sing La Marseillaise and several Christmas carols ("Un flambeau, Jeanette, Isabella..." which would not necessarily make me welcome in Quebec. I have only been to Canada three times. I have fond memories of a house on Rue Ste. Ursule in Quebec city, 45 years ago. Montreal was beautiful, too. And watching the sun rise from my sleeping bag on the deck of a steamer on the St. Lawrence river... priceless.
I'm afraid my geographical area is entirely different, so I don't have an answer to the groundcover question, but I have another gardening question. Is there anything that looks like hostas, and is a perennial, but likes full sun?
I wanted to plant hostas along the edge of my yard, until I learned that hostas prefer shade. Most of the full-sun perennials I can find are various sorts of decorative grasses. Since the rest of the yard is grassy already, I wanted something with a contrasting shape, hence hostas.
I've about decided to just plant boxwood hedges and keep them pruned very low and small.
Regarding the SF password question: 42 is really all you need.
Never, ever, ever plant Japanese knotweed. After efforts involving gallons of undiluted "total vegetation killer" (which isn't), a bulldozer, and other weapons of mass plant destruction, I still have not managed to eradicate all the spawn of a single plant. The War Upon the Knotweed will celebrate its seventh anniversary in a month or so with no end in sight.
Japanese knotweed is one of the plants on the list of banned plants in Massachusetts, banned from sale and banned from propagation (or maybe it's only a proposed banned plant list... trying to copy the URL which I have in my favorites list (yes, I use Windows--something about since working with Windows is something that is critical for my income earning, I use it at home--I stayed an Amiga user for far longer than I should have, migrating to Windows earlier would have made me a lot more attractive as an employment prospect back at the end of the 1980s and beyond) and not succeeding.
Sage doesn't do all that well in my yard--it hangs in there for three or four years coming back less and less strongly over time.
Thyme is iffy--a woody thyme plant spread out to around a couple feet and then the main part of it died off. A section of it at the extremity that had rooted at the extremity survived the nasty winter a couple years ago, that the rest of the plant didn't survive. A lemon thyme patch lost out to oregano encroachment. A lemon thyme patcht that I planted later, I've been attacking the encroachment of oregano into.
There's the spreading varieties of raspberries--I was extremely annoyed at whatever little furry animal with big sharp teeth chomped off the canes of my purple raspberry patch, I thought I was in line for a really nice crop of luscious purple raspberries from the patch this year, and then something during the winter destroyed the canes. GRUMP! Ironically, there are also gold, red, and black raspberry plants in my yard, with the wretched furry animal left alone, even though purple raspberries are a cross between black and red raspberries.
What else--oh, the wineberries. They are another Masschusetts pest plant, which have spread significantly in my yard from the original planting I did years ago from plants bought from Stark's, was it? The berries are very tasty, but the plants are extremely aggressive (too bad furry animal with sharp teeth didn't chew through wineberry canes!)
There are some desirable native plants I put in-- a couple of service berry/shadblow bushes, for example, three blueberries which are surviving despite furry animal teeth, winter, and soil that I suspect is even sourer than blueberries like! (However, across the street are some native low bush wild blueberries that I've thought about digging up some small plants of, since they're growing happily across the street on land that's been left for the brush and such to grow as it will).
The yard's marginal for "swamp azalea"--too dry. The winter killed off the branches that would have had fragrant blossoms (no, there aren't non-fragrant blossoms that the plant gets...), but new branches sprouted from the root system.
Two other things which I forgot to mention: I read SF but am not in fandom, for what it's worth with respect to my suggestion. And for gardening purposes, I'm in zone 7.
PNH: Until such time as the Canadians decide that they want a republic, Canada remains a dominion.
Caroline, both Phlox and Vinca (periwinkle) make good full sun groundcover, are evergreen and even flower. The leaves aren't as big as most Hostas, but you can get nicely variegated ones.
Should the names of species be capitalized if they are named after people? One earlier poster wrote it both ways in the same post.
For instance, Scrabble players would love to have a definitive answer to whether "io" is a proper name when it means a species of moth, although it is a proper name as a character in mythology.
Hmm. Trek and Star Wars are probably too widespread to be specifically fan-recognisable. I've used "Scream and leap".
Douglas Adams is a good one. "...replaced by something even more bizarrely inexplicable." "I just think you ought to know I'm feeling very depressed."
Pratchett should be quotable, but I can't think of any good ones offhand. Banks - perhaps people might recognise a reference to someone possessing Very Little Gravitas Indeed, or to something falling under the ambit of Special Circumstances.
Or a T-shirt, like the "I'M WITH STUPID" ones, with the words "I'M WITH MILES" and an arrow pointing to about half-past four.
"When in danger or in doubt,
Run in circles, scream and shout."
Googled 'Japanese knotweed'.
I met it in Pasadena, where it was beating out ivy in the flowerbead along the driveway. I was calling it 'weed from Hell'. When young, it might be susceptible to weedkillers (I'd try stuff designed for poison oak/poison ivy), but the older leaves are waxy; it comes up from the roots even if it's a piece a half inch long. (It is pretty. But so is poison oak, and I don't want that in my yard either.)
Patrick, Canada was originally (well, okay, from 1871) the 'Dominion of Canada' (from Psalm 72:8, "He shall have Dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth"; Canada's motto remains "A mari usque ad mare.") As Canada became more and more independent of Britain, starting around the fifties, 'Dominion of Canada' was gradually phased out in favour of just 'Canada' in legal documents. This was the usage in the Canada Act 1982, which is the act that formally severed the British parliament's sovereignty over Canada and patriated the Canadian constitution; 'Dominion Day' was renamed to 'Canada Day' later that year.
Theoretically, Canada is still the 'Dominion of Canada' but it doesn't get used in legal documents, and certainly isn't used informally, so I would have to put it in the category of 'true, but (mostly) irrelevant.'
Hello?! Sixty-seven!?
Traitor!
Fifty-Four Forty or Fight!
I think "Fear is the Mindkiller" is probably the best I've seen so far. Makes perfect sense if used in an appropriate context, but instantly clues in anyone who's read one of the Primary Works.
I've found that a good, somewhat subtle way of sniffing out Robert Jordan readers is the phrase "Great Lord help us." Whether you use that ability for Good or for Evil is at your discretion.
JennR - you meant that for xeger. To me, Pilates are the family of a Roman judge.
rams - isn't Jimsonweed very illegal? Or am I relying too heavily on CSI?
Hamadryad, I think the quote is "Klatu Barada Nikto". From "The Day The Earth Stood Still", which most fans have seen and would recognize the quote.
Niall, I always thought Vinca prefered shade. I have a large patch in an area that gets very little sun, and nothing else will grow in except weeds.
Sean --
"But not one in ten thousand knows your name"
re Japanese Knotweed --
Never had to deal with it, but did get rid of Jerusalem Artichokes by the simple expedient of splitting the stem clean through, inserting a broad wick likewise, and leaving the other end of the wick in a container of strong ammonia solution.
(broad wick = the kind appropriate to a kerosene lantern.)
Coming in a trifle late, but--central Texas, more humidity than Arizona: we have oleander, oregano and lantana (looks like mint but isn't) in our yard. Reasons: previous owner planted them, and they survived because they can tolerate full southeast exposure in high temperatures while being, even more important, deerproof. They all need heavily disciplined at least once a year, but they're all blooming nicely at the moment, so we figure the tradeoff is worth it. (Particularly in my case, because it looks like nothing can kill any of them except perhaps overwatering the lantana. This is good because I have the blackest of thumbs--even admiring a plant in a nursery is likely to make it curl up and wither.)
And the less-subtle way of identifying Robert Jordan readers is "Do you worship the Great Lord of the Dark?" Useful when meeting someone for the first time "in real life," don't use it too loudly in public places.
"42" is good, but I can't figure out ways of slipping it into conversation where it would be under the radar of the non-recognizing crowd. But then right now I'm running on low sleep and low blood sugar.
How about a variant of "Do not meddle in the affairs of [insert group here]"?
There is a debate going on to change Canada's motto to "From sea to sea to sea"/"A mari usque ad mare ad mare"/"D'un ocean aux autres". The premiers of the territories are the ones proposing it; a survey says that 44% of Canadians are for it, 17% against it, while 37% don't care.
The correct lyrics (link gives other versions, too) are indeed "We stand on guard for thee", God appears later in "God keep our land / glorious and free". There is no God mentioned in the French version.
What short phrases could be used to set off a science fiction reader's SF-radar?
any reference to TV's being given away for free to the poor, or not having "off" switches, as a side reference to "Max Headroom", a show far ahead of its time. (30 seconds into the future, if I remember correctly)
Greg
"Nightengale Hospital. Florence speaking."
wolfa --
Not by name, maybe, but from the official English translation of the French lyrics:
"As in thy arm ready to wield the sword,
So also is it ready to carry the cross."
("Il sait porter la croix" in the original.)
"We stand on God for thee" is clearly from the Boston version of the Canadian national anthem.
IIRC, African daisies do very well in Arizona
They do indeed, at least in Tucson, and you'll see lots of yards full of them in the right season. Desert marigolds, which have the bonus of being native, also do very well; mine have made it through the drought of the last few years without any supplemental watering, and there are at least a few in bloom essentially year-round. I ended up with them through the Darwinian process of sowing mixed wildflower seeds, watering them occasionally while they were getting started, and then totally ignoring them.
As previously mentioned, rosemary thrives here as well. It even grows in the totally unshaded southwestern-exposure Corner Of Death.
I have a domesticated Jimsonweed, aka Datura, growing in my backyard. I feel certain it's not illegal, because I bought it from a very mainstream garden catalog. It reseeds aggressively, has become threateningly large, and is perennial in this mild climate. But the foot-long white trumpets sure are impressive. On a Datura, the trumpets point up. On a Brugmansia, the trumpets hang down. Datura are low and bushy. Brugmansia are woodier, and easily take the shape of a small, open tree. Brugmansia are also much fussier to grow. I've had nothing but ill luck with the specimen I bought; I think our desert sun is too intense for it.
For the groundcover, do consider an oregano or a creeping thyme. Or perhaps a tufty native grass would make a nice alternative? Some varieties are bred to be "mowless" and they're usually xeric once established. I have a "Red Devil" creeping verbena that spreads vigorously, is only about an inch high, and has intensely red flowers; it loves full sun and is also quite xeric. High Country Gardens might offer some good ground cover ideas, www.highcountrygardens.com Pricey, but lots of interesting plants suited for dry, hot climates, and lots of native plants.
Nothing will inhibit Bermuda grass growth except digging up every last stalk and disposing of it. I say this after having stuggled to clear a patch for a garden plot. After repeated treatments with Roundup, it may look dead, but don't be fooled! The smallest shriveled brown bits of it left in your soil will re-root long after you thought you got rid of it. Three years later, I still have Bermuda grass randomingly sprouting in my flowerbed. Mint is not an option. You'll just have minty Bermuda grass.
Magenta:
Hamadryad's "Klatu Verata Nictu" is likely from "Army of Darkness," with the "Nictu" coughed into a fist or sleeve, since the hero wasn't really listening to the essential bits that would keep an army of the evil dead from rising up. Right up there with, "Gimme some Sugar, Baby."
Nothing will inhibit Bermuda grass growth except digging up every last stalk and disposing of it.
You could try solarization. Cover it with plastic (black preferred), weight the edges all the way around (no gaps), and wait a week. It's supposed to do in all the weed seeds by heating them beyond the maximum temperature for viability. I make no guarantees - bermuda grass is indeed persistent.
With regard to phrases -- are we staying away from Star Trek and/or Star Wars, on the grounds that many many people are familiar with both TV and movie SF but have never read SF?
My own personal touchstone phrase has been for a long time: "IMT made the sky -- fall!" But damn few SF readers know it, let alone members of the general public.
Lizzy L - there might be some that are obscure enough. "For the world is hollow—and I have touched the sky!" might do it, though I doubt it could be worked into ordinary conversation. "I'm a doctor, not a [whatever]" might work better, with whatever profession you actually are substituted for 'doctor'. And when I think a machine is really kaput and has become a doorstop, I say "It's dead, Jim." People have vague glimmers of recognition to that one, but fans light up.
Tone matters, too. At my first QA job, when I was testing a just-fixed release that was supposed to go out that very night, and the development manager came to me and said the usual "oh, come on, we just fixed it, just send it out," I said "I'm sorry, John, I can't do that." But I said it in deep, hushed, and perfectly level tones. He smiled and said "Send out the release, Hal!"
rams - isn't Jimsonweed very illegal? Or am I relying too heavily on CSI?
Datura (jimson weed) is classified by the FDA as not fit for human consumption, bus is not illegal and grows wild over most of the lower 48 and in much of the rest of the world as well. It contains atropine, hyoscyamine and scopolamine. It will get someone high BUT it's Pretty Damn Stupid to pursue it for that purpose unless they reallly just don't like life very much. The high is said to be very unpleasant, and that high could well be their last--the effective dose and the fatal dose aren't very far apart at all. Atropine poisoning is an ugly way to die.
Some plants are definitely not meant to be eaten. Datura is one of them.
You could try solarization.
You could, and in fact I intend trying it--but since bermuda's chief means of spread is not seed (though it has those too) but rhizomes, I don't believe a week would do it. (If I recall correctly you'd also want to soak the soil first.)
This is entirely unrelated to anything else in this thread, but I figure that's what an open thread is all about, right?
I was just reading an article over at Slate about accustoming pets to a new baby. The expert quoted says, "Try to find something that motivates the dog to couple with the baby."
Now, maybe it's my poor upbringing or my slightly archaic vocabulary or my tendency to find bawdry everywhere, but does that strike anyone else as a possibly infelicitous choice of verb?
The only guaranteed way to get rid of Bermuda grass is to move.
Lizzy L quotes Blish: "IMT made the sky -- fall!"
Whoa! You really ground the rust off of some of my gears with that one. Suddenly, I'm 14 years old, riding on the D train on my way to high school. I actually had to reassure myself that I was remembering the right book.
Now I want to go back and re-read it. I think I still have the paperback. But, I'm also afraid that age and (alleged) maturity may make me like the book less than its memory.
Those of us who grew up reading Berton Roueché have never forgotten the essay on the Southwestern family that attempted to breed a hardier tomato by grafting them onto Jimson weed (the plants are related, both being [cue music sting] in the nightshade family).
As I recall, no one died, but that was luck, prompt treatment, and the fact that the big red guys were so toxic that one serving was all you got.
As for the Words That Signify One as A Member of the Crowd, kemmer comes to mind, and I can indeed think of a few occasions when it could be applied (figuratively, anyway) in a conversation. But then, I am lucky enough to hang out with a lot of very interesting people.
As in "I've been in kemmer for months and can't find a partner?" Yeah, been there.
Phrases - "Digital watches are a pretty keen idea" from Hitchhiker's. I remember a meme from a while back that was the Voight-Kampff test from Bladerunner. Pratchett has some great phrases, but none I can think of that span the series, "Music with rocks in it" for example (although "Where's My Cow?" is a great non-sequitur).
Xopher, you clearly need to hop on the next NAFAL ship to Gethen.
Oops, just remembered - "What have I got in my pockets?" A little harder to slip into conversation, but it'll root out the fantasy SFers
Those of us who grew up reading Berton Roueché have never forgotten
...too many tomatoes, or carrots, will turn your skin a funny color. Too Much Carotene is not good (but it probably won't kill you).
People plant Japanese Knotweed? Are they insane? Botanical supervillains? Badly, badly misled? Knotweed makes true-believer organic gardeners reach for the bottle of Round-Up, and mild-mannered souls buy flamethrowers.
Bermuda grass is just plain evil. It exists only to provide the appearance of a grassy lawn for the benefit of Midwesterners who can't imagine not having one. It's ugly, unkillable, hyperallergenic, requires frequent watering, becomes even more hyperallergenic when wet, and mugs native species that might otherwise establish themselves.
Oleander should only be planted in desert areas that receive no supplementary watering. Under those conditions it will survive, more or less behave itself, and put out very pretty fragrant blooms. On the other hand, it will kill anything that grazes on it. It will also kill anyone who uses a stick of it as a spit to roast food over a fire. When I was a kid, I staked up one of my tomato plants with a bone-dry bark-falling-off cut-at-both-ends oleander stick that had been lying in the yard for months. My tomato promptly died, while the oleander stick took root and put out leaves.
Paula, it's classier to call the nightshade family the Solanaceae. It's my favorite family of plants, narrowly beating out the Rosaceae, because it's such an unlikely mix of basic vegetables, psychoactives, deadly poisons, and pretty flowers. You missed a few: tomatillo, tamarillo, cape gooseberry, tobacco, mandrake, henbane, Sodom apple, petunia, and the rest of the ornamentals: calibrachoa, brugmansia, brunfelsia, schizanthus, salpiglossis, browallia, nierembergia, and bittersweet. There's just no beating the solanaceae for weirdness and dash.
Why no one should ever eat jimsonweed (datura) recreationally: you can die. You can screw yourself up really badly. But even assuming you avoid those ills, you'll be seriously fckd up for some time, and you won't remember a bit of it afterward. Thus:
The James Town Weed (which resembles the Thorny Apple of Peru, and I take to be the plant so call'd) is supposed to be one of the greatest Coolers in our World. This being an early Plant, was gather'd very young for a for a boil'd Salad, by some of the soldiers sent thither, to pacify the troubles of Bacon; and some of them eat plentifully of it, the Effect of which was a very pleasant Comedy; for they turn'd natural Fools upon it for several days; One would blow up a Feather in the air; another would dart Straws at it with much Fury; and another stark naked was sitting up in a Corner, like a Monkey, grinning and making Mows at them; a Fourth would fondly kiss, and paw his Companions, and snear in their Faces, with a Countenance more antick, than any in a Dutch Droll. In this frantick Condition they were confined, lest they should in their Folly destroy themselves; though it was observed, that all their Actions were full of Innocence and good Nature. Indeed, they were not very cleanly; for they would have wallow'd in their own Excrements, if they had not been prevented. A Thousand such simple Tricks they play'd, and after Eleven Days, return'd to themselves again, not remembering any thing that had pass'd.So there.
Sarah S, it's not you. It truly is appalling.
Tully: "blind as a bat, mad as a hatter, red as a beet, hot as a hare, dry as a bone, the bowel and bladder lose their tone, and the heart runs alone."
It must be the other alkaloids that cause those symptoms, though, because atropine is also the active ingredient in flying ointment, and that makes you think you're flying. It's a much gentler dose than the near-fatal one described in the mnemonic, though; that may account for the difference.
I, too, splorked at the "Try to find something that motivates the dog to couple with the baby" line in the Slate article. I've emailed the author asking about it.
mark
It is enormous fun to sneak SF references into sample sentences, memos, business plans, quizzes and the like when teaching.
The corporate crowd responds exceedingly positively to handouts and class discussions when I work in references to fantasy and sf.
Teresa: All the members of that family have at least one poisonous part, I'm told. The weird thing is that the parts are different depending on the individual plant. Tomato flowers, potato eyes, nightshade berries...it's quite bizarre.
Try to find something that motivates the dog to couple with the baby.
This tripped me up too. And pointlessly - the author could simply have used 'bond' and the sentence would have been a lot clearer, even if you don't read 'couple' in a splork-inducing way.
My tomato promptly died, while the oleander stick took root and put out leaves.
wow.
I had a similar reaction, Greg. I'm going to use 'Oleander' as the name of a vampire character sometime.
It's a more recent reference, and it's TV not books, but I've gotten good mileage out of "Curse your sudden but inevitable [blank]".
The author of the Slate article, Emily Yoffe, was quoting Dr. Marsha Reich, a "Maryland veterinary behaviorist". The article can be found at http://www.slate.com/id/2144196
mark
My anthem makes me mad now.
Our new Prime Minister, who we nicknamed 'The Shrub' (he's a little George W.) is ruining our country.
At least it's only a minority gov't and with luck we'll bring in a better gov't the next election. I have new found sympathy for what everyone in the USA has had to endure for the past five years.
But, I'm also afraid that age and (alleged) maturity may make me like the book less than its memory. I know that fear, Larry. But you may discover that Blish ages well.
From what all the folks here have been saying, I think the plant in my garden must have been a brugmansia. It was taller than I am and I think its flowers turned down rather than up -- but am not certain. Mine was white. Others I have seen are yellow.
SF phrase #2: "You are trapped in that bright moment when you learned your doom."
Larry? Xopher?
xeger — my husband and I had a Pilates Reformer (home version, not a professional version). We wound up getting rid of it, as we found it was a hassle to get out and put away, took up too much space to be left out, and didn't seem to be giving us the results we thought we should be seeing.
What's working for us is a 20-year-old exercise video: Callanetics. Like Pilates and the Lotte Berk Method, it's based on small, gentle, controlled movements; like them, it results in longer, leaner, stronger muscles than something like weight training would. It requires no equipment, and if you have enough clear floor space to lie down on your back with your arms out to the sides, you have more than enough space to do the workout.
It's a lot tougher than it first appears. It's also very effective. These days, I look in the mirror and think "Ooh! Muscle tone!" instead of "Ugh, I look slack and listless."
Bermuda grass is just plain evil. It exists only to provide the appearance of a grassy lawn for the benefit of Midwesterners who can't imagine not having one.
Nonsense. It exists to feed my horses.
My entry into the SF fandom sweepstakes:
"the stars were going out."
People plant Japanese Knotweed? Are they insane?
Teresa, if you were speaking at me, I don't know where the stuff in Pasadena came from. It suddenly showed up one year - I'd been there for ten or twelve years at that point without ever seeing it. I think tactical nukes might kill it (that's what I wanted to use on the ivy, which Roundup didn't kill off either) but they might make the problem worse. 'The Weed that Ate California'?
Eric Sadoyama:
So we're into sf snowclones, now, are we?
Most snowclones seem to be changed after they're taken out of their original context, but "I'm a doctor, not a ______" was snowcloned before it even left TOS. According to DITL, there are 9 occurences from McCoy and another 15 in Voyager, DS9, Enterprise, and First Contact.
Are there any other snowclones like that?
Joss Whedon's work seems a likely place to find some, as he tends to like self-referential humor, but I can't think of any examples in Buffy, Serenity, or Angel.
As far as fandom signal phrases go, "I'm not dead yet! I'm getting better!" has always served me well. Another movie reference, though, so I guess literary-only fans will have to skip it.
Hum, howabout bamboo? I fell in love with the lush stands of bamboo I saw while I was in the East, but I understand that it is weedy stuff that gets very very hard and dry the following season. If I plant it, will it grow? Will I be able to get rid of it? (I'm in Zone 6b or 7a, depending on how you measure.)
-r.
" ... that bright moment *where* you learned your doom."
My favorite is: ____________ is a way of life; ---------- is just a [goddamn] hobby. F'rinstance:
Barbarism is a way of life; civilization is just a goddamn hobby.
You don't need to see his ______.
These aren't the _____ you're looking for.
He can go about his business.
Move along.
rhandir, check your friendly Sunset Western Garden Book (under 'Bamboo' actually). Some bamboos run, and some clump. The clumping ones are better to have around. (And some have edible shoots: creative weed control!)
What an incredible smell you've discovered!
If there's a bright center to the universe, you're on the planet that it's farthest from.
And of course, one of my personal favorites:
_____. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious.
Re Pratchett shibboleths, I nominate either "I aten't dead" or "Prod buttock".
Rhandir: DO NOT PLANT BAMBOO. It is the ultimate invasive. It will take over every available piece of real estate, including asphalt pavement, and reign supreme for 50 years, then the whole damn clone will bloom simultaneously and then die.
I came out of a meeting the other day, sat down, and said to two colleagues (one Firefly-literate, the other
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