<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/">
   <channel>
      <title>Making Light :: Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... :: comments</title>
      <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#comments </link>
      <description>Language, fraud, folly, truth, history, and knitting. Et cetera.</description>
      <language>en</language>
      <lastBuildDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 11:37:01 -0500</lastBuildDate>
      <generator>http://www.sixapart.com/movabletype/?v=4.34-en</generator>
      
      <item>
      <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing...</title>
      <description>I've just read a marvelous book, Under A Flaming Sky, by Daniel James Brown. The subtitle is &quot;The Great Hinckley...</description>
      <content:encoded>I've just read a marvelous book, Under A Flaming Sky, by Daniel James Brown. The subtitle is "The Great Hinckley...</content:encoded>
      <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html</link>
      </item>

      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #1 from John L</title>
         <description>comment from John L on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of all places, The Weather Channel is where I first heard of this disaster.  It was on one of their "weather disasters" segments they run every few months, and said the Hinckley fire was one of the worst and least known in US history.</p>

<p>Basically, TWC said the long hot and dry summer turned the area around Hinckley into one big tinderbox, and once a small fire got started it soon turned into a firestorm that destroyed the town and killed over 400 people.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007 11:37 AM by John L&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227069</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227069</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 11:37:01 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #2 from wired</title>
         <description>comment from wired on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hinkley has a totally cool museum on this. There's a replica of the station, and they put the museum inside that. The have items miraculously saved from the fire, stories and ledgers of people who made it through, and aid receipts for the help disbursed to the survivors. If you're in the Twin Cities, Hinkley is just over an hour up the road, and well worth the visit.</p>

<p>I didn't take pictures in the museum, but here are some of the memorial: http://www.flickr.com/photos/13571352@N04/tags/hinkley/ <br />
The mass-grave trenches are still visible.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007 12:00 PM by wired&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227076</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227076</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 12:00:37 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #3 from Lori Coulson</title>
         <description>comment from Lori Coulson on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another good one, Jim!</p>

<p>I first heard of this fire through a song that Juanita sings about one of the engineers you mention above. I'll have to ask her for the title on that one....</p>

<p>(Juanita collects books on disasters -- is this a new one? If so, I'll alert Bruce, it would probably make a good Christmas present for her.)</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  1:31 PM by Lori Coulson&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227108</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227108</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:31:37 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #4 from Mary Frances</title>
         <description>comment from Mary Frances on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Jim--I love books like this. It can go on my shelf next to the book about the circus fire in Hartford CN and McCullough's book about the Johnstown Flood.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  1:35 PM by Mary Frances&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227110</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227110</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:35:07 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #5 from Linkmeister</title>
         <description>comment from Linkmeister on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From here to the State Library website, where I learn there are two copies in the system and promptly request one.  How the heck did I survive without an online library catalog?</p>

<p>Thanks, Jim.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  1:38 PM by Linkmeister&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227113</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227113</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:38:34 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #6 from eric</title>
         <description>comment from eric on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another dealing with similar subject matter is Norman Maclean's "Young Men and the Fire", about smokejumpers going in on the Mann Gulch Fire outside of Helena MT, and having it blow over and kill all but three of them. </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  2:40 PM by eric&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227129</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227129</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 14:40:42 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #7 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a fairly new book.  The hardcover came out from Lyons Press in May '06.  The trade paperback (which is what I read) came out in August '07.</p>

<p>The same day, the same weather system, Brown points out, created other fires as far east as Pennsylvania.  Other towns that were damaged or destroyed by  fires included Park Falls and Fifield, Wisconsin, where my grandparents were living at the time, and where my mother would be born some ten  years later.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  2:40 PM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227130</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227130</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 14:40:46 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #8 from Lizzy L</title>
         <description>comment from Lizzy L on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any bookshelf with books about great fires should have George R. Stewart's (yes, that George R. Stewart, who wrote <i>Storm</i> and <i>Earth Abides</i>) novel <i>Fire</i>. It is the story of the life and death of a California forest fire, and was first published in 1948. </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  2:45 PM by Lizzy L&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227134</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227134</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 14:45:09 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #9 from TChem</title>
         <description>comment from TChem on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mary Frances #4: What book was that about the Hartford Circus Fire? I'd be curious to read that sometime--my grandmother and her siblings were supposed to go to the circus that day, but the youngest came down with the flu. They didn't hear what happened until my grandmother came home early from work, shellshocked because she hadn't heard about the change of plans.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  3:37 PM by TChem&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227162</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227162</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:37:51 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #10 from Lis Riba</title>
         <description>comment from Lis Riba on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having spent a portion of my childhood in Wisconsin, I was always fascinated by the Peshtigo Fire.</p>

<p>Happened the same night as the Chicago fire, and much more massive, but because it happened in the backwoods of Wisconsin, it never got the same attention.</p>

<p>1.5 million acres burned, deathtoll uncertain but in the thousands -- Wikipedia<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peshtigo_Fire" rel="nofollow">*</a> calls it most deaths by fire in US history until 9/11.</p>

<p>But what grabs you most is the personal accounts.</p>

<p>I remember writing a paper on the subject for which I went to the state archives to read the old papers and anniversary interviews with the last survivors.</p>

<p>Human stories. I concur.<br />
Too bad K-12 history education seems to have lost site of that fact in favor of testable facts, because the human stories are what make history so fascinating. [So saith someone who discovered a love for the subject within the last decade and marvels how schools made it so boring.]</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  3:47 PM by Lis Riba&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227165</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227165</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:47:07 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #11 from Leva Cygnet</title>
         <description>comment from Leva Cygnet on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James, if memory serves, that nationwide outbreak of fires was what spawned the forest service's decades-long attitude towards fires of surpressing 'em all.</p>

<p>Many of the fires that blew up over a few day's period were controlled burns set by farmers or Native Americans, for a variety of reasons. The national-level reaction was to start a campaign against ANY wildfires, putting out even "good" fires as a matter of course and not doing nearly enough controlled burning. </p>

<p>The end result has not been exactly good for long-term fire surpression.</p>

<p>(I have family in Payson, AZ, with a remote cabin on a ridge at the end of a dirt road, and I very well know the fear of smelling woodsmoke on a hot, dry, windy summer day. Or of seeing the pumper truck go roaring up the road, followed by the growl of airplanes overhead. This book would probably give me nightmares -- when Jim talks about bug-out bags, my first association with bugging out is the possibility of bugging out with a wildire at my heels.)</p>

<p>-- Leva</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  3:56 PM by Leva Cygnet&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227171</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227171</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:56:22 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #12 from Linkmeister</title>
         <description>comment from Linkmeister on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lizzy L, if you liked those by Stewart, you might like his <i>Ordeal by Hunger</i>.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  4:57 PM by Linkmeister&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227191</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227191</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 16:57:05 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #13 from Mary Aileen</title>
         <description>comment from Mary Aileen on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TChem (9): I'm not Mary Frances, but I'm guessing she means <i>Circus Fire</i>, by Stewart O'Nan. There's also a novel, <i>Masters of Illusion</i>, by Mary-Ann Tirone Smith, and a book of poems, <i>Worlds Afire</i>, by Paul B. Janeczko. (Only that last is still in print; try your local library for the others.)</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  5:24 PM by Mary Aileen&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227200</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227200</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:24:35 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #14 from Lizzy L</title>
         <description>comment from Lizzy L on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Linkmeister, that one pushed too many of my buttons... But it's one hell of a book.</p>

<p>Donner, party of 2,...<br />
Donner, party of 1...</p>

<p>/ducks</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  5:38 PM by Lizzy L&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227205</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227205</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:38:10 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #15 from Linkmeister</title>
         <description>comment from Linkmeister on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lizzy L,</p>

<p>"Hello, my name is Hastings.  I'll be your <i>maitre d'</i> this trip."</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  5:48 PM by Linkmeister&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227213</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227213</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:48:02 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #16 from Mary Frances</title>
         <description>comment from Mary Frances on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TChem @ 9 and Mary Aileen @ 13: Yes, it was Stewart O'Nan's <em>Circus Fire</em> that I was thinking of--thanks, Mary Aileen. I couldn't remember the author's name and didn't have time to look it up. I checked, and the book does seem to be still available in paperback, from Anchor (according to Amazon). Also on Amazon was one I seem to have missed--<em>A Matter of Degree: The Hartford Circus Fire and the Mystery of Little Miss 1565</em>, by Don Massey and Rick Davey; that one seems to be mostly about one of the more celebrated "never identified" victims of the fire, an eight-year-old girl. The O'Nan book is a fascinating read (though--warning--if I remember correctly it requires a fairly strong stomach); I'll have to check out the Massey and Davey myself.</p>

<p>Lis Riba @ 10: Did you know there was a book about the Peshtigo fire? I didn't, until I ran across it just now on Amazon--<em>Firestorm at Peshtigo: A Town, Its People, and the Deadliest Fire in American History</em>, by Denise Getz and William Lutz.  Apparently there was a circus involved in that fire, too, in some way . . .</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  6:32 PM by Mary Frances&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227240</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227240</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 18:32:10 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #17 from Sarah</title>
         <description>comment from Sarah on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(I admit I'm fascinated by the "do a controlled burn and then step into the tiny firebreak you've made" strategy that saved the guy in the song, because it's the only time the phrase "fighting fire with fire" has made any sense to me.)</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  7:22 PM by Sarah&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227246</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227246</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 19:22:28 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #18 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There's a great <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/B000BITUGG/ref=nosim/madho usemanor/" rel="nofollow">documentary on the Donner Party</a> directed by Ric Burns (Ken's brother).  Again, recommended.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  7:54 PM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227248</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227248</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 19:54:37 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #19 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>See also:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/0805072934/ref=nosim/madhousemanor/" rel="nofollow">Firestorm at Peshtigo: A Town, Its People, and the Deadliest Fire in American History</a></p>

<p><a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/0062517783/ref=nosim/madhousemanor/" rel="nofollow">Ghosts of the Fireground: Echoes of the Great Peshtigo Fire and the Calling of a Wildland Firefighter</a></p>

<p><a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/1597160113/ref=nosim/madhousemanor/" rel="nofollow">Wildfire!: The 1871 Peshtigo Firestorm (X-Treme Disasters That Changed America)</a></p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  8:16 PM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227253</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227253</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 20:16:38 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #20 from Epacris</title>
         <description>comment from Epacris on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*blinks*  I would find the name O'nan a fairly memorable one, meself; but mebbe that's just me.</p>

<p><br />
[shatner]&hellip; must &hellip; resist &hellip; jocularity [/shatner]</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  8:54 PM by Epacris&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227271</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227271</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 20:54:20 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #21 from Catherine Winters</title>
         <description>comment from Catherine Winters on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm reminded (for obvious reasons) of <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oaRr6A-gkA" rel="nofollow">this</a>.</p>

<p>Hmm, telegraph dispatchers as heroic archetype?</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007  9:26 PM by Catherine Winters&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227284</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227284</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:26:27 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #22 from Dori</title>
         <description>comment from Dori on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sarah @ 17: are you thinking of <a href="http://www.mysongbook.de/msb/songs/c/coldmiss.html" rel="nofollow">Cold Missouri Waters</a>? If so, it's about the 1949 Mann Gulch fire in Montana (the same one Eric @ 6 mentioned).<br />
</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007 11:48 PM by Dori&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227329</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227329</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 23:48:12 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #23 from Rainflame</title>
         <description>comment from Rainflame on 14.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Burning an Empire: The Study of American Forest Fires, by Stewart H. Holbrook, has a section on the Peshtigo fire as well as several other well-known fires.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 14, 2007 11:55 PM by Rainflame&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227330</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227330</guid>
         <pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 23:55:27 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #24 from Paul</title>
         <description>comment from Paul on 15.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was highly surprised that the Great Hinckley Fire didn't make the "Minnesota 150" list that the Minnesota Historical Society has compiled. It seems to have been nominated but didn't quite make the cut. Given some of the odder choices I saw at the exhibit that DID get accepted, it baffles me.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.mnhs.org/exhibits/mn150/" rel="nofollow">http://www.mnhs.org/exhibits/mn150/"</a></p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 15, 2007  5:35 AM by Paul&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227389</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227389</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 05:35:46 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #25 from Alex</title>
         <description>comment from Alex on 15.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And there was me thinking the world's first firestorm occurred in the Surrey Docks, Rotherhithe, London in August 1940.</p>

<p>Presumably that should be "world's first <em>artificial</em> firestorm."</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 15, 2007  9:55 AM by Alex&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227445</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227445</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 09:55:04 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #26 from C. Wingate</title>
         <description>comment from C. Wingate on 15.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pictures of a fire whirlwind breaking off from the <a href="http://www.wildlandfire.com/pics/fletcher/fletcher.htm" rel="nofollow">Fletcher Fire</a> of 2007. "[The analyst] estimated the winds to be Category 2 on the Fujita Scale."</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 15, 2007  3:52 PM by C. Wingate&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227577</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227577</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:52:48 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #27 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 15.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The iron fence around the Hinckley cemetery, seen in Wired's photos (#2 above), was put up by John Currie, the town's druggist, one of the firestorm's survivors.  He'd made it out of town on the Best/Barry train. </p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 15, 2007  5:45 PM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227597</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227597</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 17:45:12 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #28 from oldnumberseven</title>
         <description>comment from oldnumberseven on 16.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just wanted to second <a href="http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227129" rel="nofollow">Eric</a>'s comment above about 'Young Men and Fire.'  It is a very good book.  One thing I have always liked about Maclean was his descriptions, well of almost anything, but the land especially.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 16, 2007  3:31 AM by oldnumberseven&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227724</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227724</guid>
         <pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:31:49 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #29 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 16.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan Brown has written to me to say that he's working on a book about the Donner Party.</p>

<p>Here's an <a href="http://www.miamiherald.com/540/story/285765.html" rel="nofollow">op/ed he wrote</a> about the recent California wildfires (reprinted numerous places).</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 16, 2007 10:20 AM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227792</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227792</guid>
         <pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 10:20:10 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #30 from Lisa Padol</title>
         <description>comment from Lisa Padol on 16.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here's a third for _Young Men and Fire_, though I still can't quite read a contour map well, and I am too much a provincial city girl to grok, well, country.</p>

<p>I learned about the Mann Gulch fire from Bill Gawne, when he sang "Cold Missouri Waters", and when I asked about it, he recommended the book.</p>

<p>Songs are often stories too. (Okay, that's preaching to the choir.) I learned about the men rowing from Athens to Lesbos to save 9,000 lives when Bill sang Zeke Hoskin's song "Mytilene's Reprieve", and Bill referred me to Herodotus.<br />
</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 16, 2007 10:50 AM by Lisa Padol&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227806</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227806</guid>
         <pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 10:50:18 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #31 from oldnumberseven</title>
         <description>comment from oldnumberseven on 16.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lisa Padol,</p>

<p>If you like Herodotus, you might also check out a book called the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_White_Goddess" rel="nofollow">White Goddess</a> by Robert Graves.  The two books supplemented one another in my sparse education of the ancient world.  Everything I ever got, I learned out of books.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 16, 2007 12:12 PM by oldnumberseven&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227849</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227849</guid>
         <pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 12:12:32 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #32 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 16.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Be aware that <i>The White Goddess</i> is Robert Graves doing poetic theory.  As a work of sober history ... it isn't.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 16, 2007 12:28 PM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227857</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227857</guid>
         <pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 12:28:13 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #33 from oldnumberseven</title>
         <description>comment from oldnumberseven on 16.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James D. Macdonald,</p>

<p>You don't think Graves was sober?</p>

<p>Just kidding.  When I read the book I can see it, though, if that makes any sense, not as much as Herodotus or Plutarch, and it is all speculation on Graves' part.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 16, 2007  1:04 PM by oldnumberseven&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227876</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#227876</guid>
         <pubDate>Fri, 16 Nov 2007 13:04:33 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #34 from Jan Vaněk jr.</title>
         <description>comment from Jan Vaněk jr. on 19.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James D. Macdonald #29: You had me scared there; I thought it was the other (or the first?) Dan Brown.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 19, 2007 11:32 AM by Jan Vaněk jr.&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#228957</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#228957</guid>
         <pubDate>Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:32:40 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #35 from MJB</title>
         <description>comment from MJB on 20.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>"A fire-safety engineer recently remarked that the Life Safety Code should be treated as a sacred text, since every paragraph in it required the sacrifice of one or more human lives."  </p>

<p>page 46, "Asbestos and Fire: Technological Tradeoffs and the Body at Risk" by Rachel Maines</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 20, 2007  2:56 PM by MJB&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#229381</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#229381</guid>
         <pubDate>Tue, 20 Nov 2007 14:56:19 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #36 from Patrick Nielsen Hayden</title>
         <description>comment from Patrick Nielsen Hayden on 29.Nov.07</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want to belatedly note that I just finished <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/006123625X/ref=nosim/madhousemanor/" rel="nofollow">Under a Flaming Sky</a>, and it's every bit as good as Jim says it is.</p>

<p>Teresa and I had pretty much the same experience: once we started it, we were unable to even think of reading anything else.  Absolutely fascinating.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 29, 2007  8:54 AM by Patrick Nielsen Hayden&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#231591</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#231591</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:54:44 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #37 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 13.Nov.08</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.asylumeclectica.com/asylum/sightseer/us/mn/hinckley.htm" rel="nofollow">A visit to the Hinckley Fire Museum</a>.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 13, 2008  8:45 AM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#307540</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#307540</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 13 Nov 2008 08:45:47 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #38 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 13.Nov.08</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1_u-eAq5QU" rel="nofollow">A backdraft.</a></p>

<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpWkfMkJ0Pg" rel="nofollow">Another backdraft.</a>  (Looks like a training situation.)</p>

<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cgujgGh9Pk" rel="nofollow">Yet another backdraft.</a></p>

<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Q_ykevbZc" rel="nofollow">A flashover.</a>  (Training situation.)</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted November 13, 2008  6:01 PM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#307587</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#307587</guid>
         <pubDate>Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:01:35 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #39 from Xopher sees cryptic spam</title>
         <description>comment from Xopher sees cryptic spam on 13.Jul.09</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As in, WTF?</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted July 13, 2009  1:32 PM by Xopher sees cryptic spam&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#352799</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#352799</guid>
         <pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:32:32 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #40 from abi</title>
         <description>comment from abi on 13.Jul.09</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think they're testing our defenses; there's no sensible payload here.</p>

<p>In other words, if we don't clean it up, they know the threads are undefended, and the next lot will be the bad stuff.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted July 13, 2009  1:44 PM by abi&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#352803</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#352803</guid>
         <pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:44:53 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #41 from James D. Macdonald</title>
         <description>comment from James D. Macdonald on 16.May.11</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/16/wildfire-destroys-half-of-town-of-9800/" rel="nofollow">Wildfire destroys half of town of 9,800</a></p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted May 16, 2011 11:44 AM by James D. Macdonald&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#551981</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#551981</guid>
         <pubDate>Mon, 16 May 2011 11:44:42 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #42 from Terry Karney</title>
         <description>comment from Terry Karney on 16.May.11</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/04/17/texas.forest.fires/index.html?iref=obnetwork" rel="nofollow">Texas fires threaten homes, and college, will last for weeks, maybe months</a></p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted May 16, 2011 12:29 PM by Terry Karney&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#551988</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#551988</guid>
         <pubDate>Mon, 16 May 2011 12:29:54 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
      <item>
         <title>Of Fire, Fire, Fire I Sing... -- comment #43 from Torrilin</title>
         <description>comment from Torrilin on 27.Jun.11</description>
         <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just spent the morning talking a friend into evacuating from the Las Conchas fire. He's off work due to the fire threatening the office. He's under a voluntary evac order. And the NOAA report is not good.</p>

<p>Even so, it took about 4 hours for him to be ready to go.</p>

<p>I think it's time to double-check the family go-bags.</p>]]>
	 &lt;p&gt;Posted June 27, 2011  1:28 PM by Torrilin&lt;/p&gt;</content:encoded>
         <link>http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#561198</link>
         <guid isPermaLink="true">http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/009586.html#561198</guid>
         <pubDate>Mon, 27 Jun 2011 13:28:35 -0500</pubDate>
      </item>
      
   </channel>
</rss>