Cate> Finding a good critique group IRL can be near impossible depending on where you live and what you write. I never managed it, but I'm a bit of an antisocial person IRL, too.
Online, it's a touch easier, but it's easy to be intimidated by groups like Critters. Also, I was in Critters intensively for about six months. I did more critiquing than I received, and what I received was not that helpful. The one thing I got out of it was that it convinced me to put aside the novel I'd been banging my head against for three years and work on something else. (So, of course, I pick up one I've been banging my head against for four years.)
After which, I stopped writing for about eight months. :P
Critters has a wide userbase. This has its advantages as well as its detriments. I had a tendency to get people critiquing my work that were not familiar with my subgenres and really hated that type of story along with people that liked it. The people that hated the subgenre often had advice completely opposite from what people who liked it said. At the time, getting that many divided opinions confused the hell out of me.
I've had more luck over at Evolution, the writers' site I administrate. I have some good friends from there, who I know write well and are open to the sort of thing I write--and who aren't afraid to tell me, "Nonny, this sucks boulders through barstraws; it's not fit to line the litterbox with" if I've really screwed up.
For me, it's been more important to get the opinion of someone I know writes well rather than someone random--because I've also had numerous random people tell me to resort to cliches. *rolls eyes*
Nonny
Michelle> I know how truly horrible my first submissions were. Put it this way, I started when I was fifteen and what I wrote then probably should have been burned. Yet, I submitted it. (How sad is it that I was more professional in my submissions practices than my actual writing? :P)
Someone else, however, wrote to the guy, and posted the response in his LJ. It's here for anyone who's interested ... let's say, after reading that, I'll be quite surprised if I receive a civil reply.
Nonny
Lord Christ and Lady Bast. That's ... well ... I have to admire the person's guts and creativity. Really, I do. And at least he's honest enough to himself about not selling much with a self-published book.
Me being a nosy bitch, I wrote him and mentioned AuthorHouse's class-action lawsuit. And gave him some links to find more information. Figure, what the hell.
Nonny
Tracina said: One of the dynamics that makes an exchange of ideas on this topic difficult is that since the swindlers claim the victims were asking for it, statements pointing out that the victims acted unwisely are often interpreted as, "They asked for it."
Which is not what I said. I'm saying there is fault on both sides, and I don't feel much pity for someone who buys into scams that have an incredible amount of information about them online.
That said, there are other scams that don't appear as such. My girlfriend recently submitted a story to a magazine; when they rejected it, they included a blurb about their editorial services. I'm still not entirely sure if that market is a scam, or if they just have no sense of what's appropriate to put in a rejection letter.
So, I agree. It's not black and white in all cases. But, the majority of scam victims I've heard would not have gotten into that situation had they researched and used a little bit of common sense. (Then again, maybe the people who say it's uncommon sense are right ... :P)
Nonny
Lenora: I never meant to insinuate that it was a crime of any sort. You used the analogy of someone walking down a dark alley swinging her purse ... how can such a person not expect to be taken advantage of?
I feel it is something deeply wrong culturally that people are not adequately educated in matters of life, and nor are they encouraged to seek such education. People trust what they are told too easily, and they get hurt because of it.
It's not people asking for help I have a problem with. I've known people who were a prime target for scammers, got scammed, and then spent the next whatever whining about it rather than learning from the incident. It's the victimized behavior that infuriates me.
I had a friend get suckered by Poetry.com a couple years back. He came in chat, all excited about the acceptance, and I had to break it to him that it was a scam. He was upset, but he learned from the incident. (And, frankly, of all the scams I've heard of, Poetry.com is one of the least harmful.)
When I say I don't have sympathy, I don't mean that I'm going to be outright harsh to people like that. I'm polite and I can fake sympathy damn well, but some of the scams out there are so blatant that I would think that it would be obvious to anyone they were a scam.
Then again, I've never been naive in that way. Rather, I have a distinct tendency to pessimism and cynicism ... :P
Nonny
While there are certainly many scam markets that take advantage of new writers, I've never been able to feel much sympathy for them. I hear a lot of people say that it's easy to be scammed, but really ... it's only easy if you believe the first thing you hear. Information on scammers is not that difficult to find, especially with the Internet. A google search on PublishAmerica comes up with one of Teresa's blog articles as the second result, for example.
There are many, many writer's sites out there providing information about scammers. Preditors and Editors, The Rumor Mill, and Writer Beware at SFWA are only a few.
I don't have much sympathy for stupidity, and many of these scams are so blatant and so well-known amongst the writing community that it's easy to find information on them.
I know I probably sound harsh, but a half hour is all it would take to find the needed information to educate you about a scammer. More likely than not, less. Scammers are con artists and anytime anyone turns on the charm, you ought be suspicious. (This holds true for matters outside publishing, as well.)
Yes, we were all new to writing and submission once. But I know that the first thing I did when I decided to actually start submitting was research the subject. That way I knew what to do, what not to do, and what to avoid. What's truly sad is that I knew more about submitting at the time than actually writing. LOL.
If everyone took the time to properly educate themselves, scammers would be shit out of luck.
Nonny
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| 2004 | 7 |
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