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January 21, 2003

Electrolite regular Simon Shoedecker remarks, in a comment to this post, that “‘America the Beautiful’ is a nice song, but it would make a bad national anthem because America is about its Constitution and governmental ethics, not about the land it happens to occupy.”

As it happens, I was singing “America the Beautiful” just the other day, while ambling along with a bunch of fellow travellers and other riff-raff. So I wonder if Simon has looked at the full lyrics lately, which seem to me to be as much about history as they are about landscape:

O beautiful for glory-tale
Of liberating strife
When once and twice, for man’s avail
Men lavished precious life!
I’ve noted before that “America the Beautiful” is unusual among patriotic songs in that it actually acknowledges that its subject is imperfect, a work in progress:
America! America!
God mend thine every flaw,
Confirm thy soul in self-control,
Thy liberty in law!
I’m down with that.

George “The Blogger’s Chew Toy” Orwell once speculated that the tendency to skip the “Confound their politics / Frustrate their knavish tricks” part of “God Save the King” might stem from Tory suspicion that those lines referred to them. Likewise, it’s easy to imagine the party of Greed Is Good being unenthusiastic about this:

America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
Till selfish gain no longer stain
The banner of the free!
But it’s definitely not about landscape. You gotta give it that. [02:06 PM]
Welcome to Electrolite's comments section.
Hard-Hitting Moderator: Teresa Nielsen Hayden.

Comments on Electrolite regular:

Simon Shoedecker ::: (view all by) ::: January 21, 2003, 05:08 PM:

Well, the first verse is about landscape. And since, as fans of the later verses of "The Star-Spangled Banner" well know, the first verse is all that usually gets sung ...

I was trying for an oblique response to a poster who seemed to be saying that he loved America for its land. This did not seem to me what America is especially loveable for. (Nice though the land is.)

But thank you for pointing out that the author of "America the Beautiful" realized this too.

Anna Feruglio Dal Dan ::: (view all by) ::: January 21, 2003, 05:51 PM:

Well, apart from the other laudable things about ATB, nothing wrong about appreciating the landscape, I feel. "Nice place we're living in, innit?" beats "God loves us above all other peoples" which seems to be the theme of far too many hymns. (Ours, hilariously, just to mention one).

Besides, drawing attention to the fact that the landscape is sort of valuable right now isn't such a bad idea.

Stefan Jones ::: (view all by) ::: January 21, 2003, 06:38 PM:

Odd, tangential, thought:

The giant unaccountable bureaucracy being built in D.C. (or, well, in a conservative Virginia suburb) has a refreshingly honest name. Their mandate is to defend the "homeland" . . . not necessarily the rights and freedoms of its civilians.

david jordan ::: (view all by) ::: January 21, 2003, 11:35 PM:

ever since i saw the movie "moscow on the hudson", i've thought duke ellington's "take the 'a' train" (actually composed by billy strayhorn) would make a dandy anthem.
for a few reasons, it's a toe-tapper, (a good way to start a ballgame!) it positevly reeks of america, but most importantly it has no lyrics, and let's face it, words are always going to piss someone off, aren't they?

Matt ::: (view all by) ::: January 21, 2003, 11:36 PM:

I wouldn't just say that the first verse is all that USUALLY gets sung. I have to say, I have never -- ever -- in any context, heard another verse of "America the Beautiful" sung aloud. And I'd have to say that the case of those who would have ATB as our National Anthem is rooted in its perceived inoffensiveness -- who's going to argue that the land's not beautiful -- as contrasted with the fiery martial rhetoric of the Star Spangled Banner. But which song deals with actual humans, rather than "purple mountain's majesties," whatever those might be?

That said, I'm no fan of the SSB. And reading the lyrics posted above, I can only revile both songs for their hilariously awful nineteenth-century doggerel lyrics. (I never thought of "self-control" as a defining American virtue.)

My vote is for "This Land Is Your Land" by notorious leftist Woody Guthrie.

Patrick Nielsen Hayden ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 12:00 AM:

I bow to no one in my admiration for Woody Guthrie. I read Bound for Glory when I was 11, which is true devotion. But I don't see what's "hilariously awful" about "America the Beautiful." It seems entirely sincere and authentic to me.

Then again, what do I know? I'm actually in favor of "brotherhood" and other "hilariously awful" 19th-century notions. Stupid, outdated, hilariously awful me.

Stefanie Murray ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 01:36 AM:

"Take the 'A' Train" does have lyrics, actually:

"You must take the 'A'-Train
To go to Sugar Hill way up in Harlem
If you miss the 'A'-Train
You'll find you missed the quickest way to Harlem
Hurry - get on now it's coming
Listen - to these rails a-humming - all board
get on the "A"-Train
Soon You will be on Sugar Hill in Harlem"

Catchy, but more geographically informative than stirring or patriotic. :)

As for ATB, I think the most surreal moment of the TV celeb-fest telethon for 9/11 last year was all those famous people singing ATB with Willie Nelson and not knowing the lyrics to any of the other verses (which he sang: the "stern impassioned stress," "alabaster cities gleam," etc).

We *did* have to learn all the verses to ATB, and sing them, in my elementary school. But then, we had to learn and sing "Senor Don Gato," too....

John ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 02:12 AM:

Speaking of God Save the King", check out this verse:

Lord grant that Marshal Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
And like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush.
God save the King!

I imagine that verse doesn't get sung very frequently.

Xopher ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 07:22 AM:

Steffanie, was that the one about the cat who dies and is reanimated (the only time I've ever heard 4th graders use that word) by the smell of fish?

I vote for TLIYL, too. A sense that the country is ours and our responsibility is a good thing to instill in our schoolkids -- even if the later verses are rarely or never sung.

Stefanie Murray ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 02:08 PM:

Xopher,

It is, indeed! And it was the first time I had ever heard the word 'reanimated.' Though my favorite verse is

"broke his ribs and all his whiskers, meow meow meow,
and his little solar plexus, meow meow meow.
'Ay caramba!' cried Don Gato."

As another Guthrie fan, I am pro-TLIYL as well. But, to be fair, it has its own hidden surprises:

"As I was walking, I saw a sign there,
And on the sign it said, 'No trespassing.'
But on the other side it didn't say nothing.
That side was made for you and me."

Just sayin'.

Xopher ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 04:06 PM:

Actually I like the idea that land can't be owned. "You cannot own the land/the land owns you," as another song puts it.

david jordan ::: (view all by) ::: January 22, 2003, 10:45 PM:

that's exactly why the natives sold manhattan for trinkets, they thought that owning land was as useless as owning the sky or the wind.

Xopher ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 10:44 AM:

They also weren't the ones who actually used that land, from what I hear. So who got bilked? Well, certainly the tribes whose home turf WAS Manhattan.

Some math book I used to have claimed that the $24 would be worth much more than Manhattan today if it had been invested at 5% compounded interest, or something like that. Yeah, and there were lots of banks paying that in 1620 America. Not to mention that if you take all the money you spend on food for your kids, and invest it, you'll have MUCH more money at the end...not counting your legal bills for homicide by neglect, of course.

Chip Hitchcock ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 11:53 AM:

I hope the rest of Xopher's math book was more reliable than its calculation of the worth of Manhattan; "dc" tells me that $24 compounded at 5% for 379 years is $4.2 billion, which is $4 per square foot -- which sounds like less than a month's rental for office space (not land space), per the bookstore discussion of last month. (Datum point: in 1994 the appraisal on my house in suburban Boston worked out to a land value of $20 per square foot.)

But 5% might be modest for an investment; in "Compounded Interest", 10% is described as a modest rate from ~15th-century Italian banker. (It was also described as the historic return of the U.S. stock market, by investment advisers warning during the 1990s that the current high returns shouldn't be expected to continue.) At that rate Manhattan land would be worth $180 million per square foot. So maybe memory is unreliable. (Not surprising -- the only part of pre-algebra I specifically remember is the part where the teacher was wrong.)

Returning to topic: musically SSB is a disaster, so much so that it may not even be sung live. (My chorus, with an assortment of professional credits, was looking at a Red Sox performance, which would have been taped and lip-synched.) I'm told "To Anacreon in Heaven" was written as a showpiece, not intended to be sung by most people; the range (spread between highest and lowest notes) is the total range of a baritone chorister per my composition textbook, which means most people will lose notes at one end or the other.
It's not surprising that the old texts are unsatisfactory; -"The past is a different country."- (Try handing a typical piece of 50's science fiction to a woman unfamiliar with the genre. I recommend an asbestos suit.) I'd like to see new attempts, but wouldn't bet they'd work; it's difficult to combine balanced language with music, which speaks to the reactions rather than the intellect. "This Land is Your Land" has possibilities; the bits I know aren't as overtly political as Guthrie's reputation, but that reputation would probably get the Limbaughs and Delays up on their hind legs in protest.

Simon Shoedecker ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 01:09 PM:

"To Anachreon in Heaven," showpiece or not, was a very popular tune in those days - the SSB is far from the only American patriotic song of the era written to that tune. I believe today they'd be called filksongs. We're lucky that Key's was the one that survived: the others I've seen are really bad.

Dim memories have come to mind of a short-lived 1960s sitcom whose premise was that Manhattan was bought from Indians who didn't actually own it (I'm sure we're skipping over the meaning of the word "own" in this context; never mind, it's a sitcom), and that the heir of the real owners has come to New York to reclaim his property.

I didn't know "Take the A Train" had words, beyond a random mumbled "Take the A train, oh yeah ... fastest way to get to Harlem." I didn't even know it had a recognizable tune. The jazz renditions of it I've heard were not designed to emphasize either of these things.

Jeremy Osner ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 02:59 PM:

Doesn't SSB also have further verses which are not sung because noone (myself included) learns them? Seem to remember seeing further verses then forgetting them. My vote would go for "This Land is Your Land", or maybe "Anarchy in the U.K." :)

Xopher ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 04:25 PM:

On SSB/To Anakreon in Heaven: it was originally a Glee Club song. Glee Clubs were drinking gangs, mostly. Some of them started singing, and they became known primarily as singing groups. But the drinking aspect has never fully vanished.

My take on TAIH is that after enough drinks, nobody had any pitch sense anymore anyway, so if you fifthed the octaves (a common practice on "Happy Birthday" as sung by restaurant staff), no one would care.

The words of TAIH bear out the idea that alcohol was a major factor:

To Anakreon in Heaven,
Where he sat in full glee,
A few sons of Harmony sent a petition:
That he their inspir-
Er and patron would be,
And this answer came back from the jolly old Grecian:
"Voice, fiddle, and flute
No longer be mute!
I'll lend you my name,
And inspire you to boot.
What's more, I will teach you
Like me to entwine
The myrtle of Venus
With Bacchus's vine."
(from memory; may have one or more word errors)

If you know the Greek word for 'inspirer' and what else that word was used for, you realize how much this would scandalize many a modern person.

Xopher ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 04:28 PM:

And I learned all the verses to SSB in 3rd grade (now have forgotten them). Almost put me off the song for good. "Then conquer we must/when our cause it is just/and this be our motto: in God is our trust" kind o' left me with icks. There's much, much worse.

David ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 04:55 PM:

The third verse of the SSB puts me off:

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country should leave us no more!
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps' pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave:
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!


My choice for an anthem would be "Lift Every Voice and Sing":

Lift every voice and sing
Till earth and heaven ring,
Ring with the harmonies of Liberty;
Let our rejoicing rise
High as the listening skies,
Let it resound loud as the rolling sea.
Sing a song full of the faith that the dark past has taught us,
Sing a song full of the hope that the present has brought us,
Facing the rising sun of our new day begun
Let us march on till victory is won.

Stony the road we trod,
Bitter the chastening rod,
Felt in the days when hope unborn had died;
Yet with a steady beat,
Have not our weary feet
Come to the place for which our fathers sighed?
We have come over a way that with tears has been watered,
We have come, treading our path through the blood of the slaughtered,
Out from the gloomy past,
Till now we stand at last
Where the white gleam of our bright star is cast.

God of our weary years,
God of our silent tears,
Thou who has brought us thus far on the way;
Thou who has by Thy might
Led us into the light,
Keep us forever in the path, we pray.
Lest our feet stray from the places, Our God, where we met Thee,
Lest, our hearts drunk with the wine of the world, we forget Thee;
Shadowed beneath Thy hand,
May we forever stand.
True to our GOD,
True to our native land.

Patrick Nielsen Hayden ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 05:27 PM:

"Take the 'A' Train" doesn't have a recognizable tune? Marvelous is the diversity of human perception.

Simon Shoedecker ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 06:03 PM:

I wonder who claimed that "Take the A Train" didn't have a recognizable tune. It certainly wasn't me: what I said was,

I didn't even know it had a recognizable tune. The jazz renditions of it I've heard were not designed to emphasize either of these things.

Look, I've heard catchy old standards like "My Favorite Things" done in jazz renditions in which I could not recognize a tune, let alone that particular familiar tune.

This is a function of a certain style of jazz rendition, or a function of the intersection between it and my mind. Any rendition of "Take the A Train" with the tune (whatever it is) done straight has presumably not come to my ears. This may well be because I haven't looked very hard. But I haven't looked very hard because most of the jazz that comes to my ears is the kind that seems to delete the tune.

Stefanie Murray ::: (view all by) ::: January 23, 2003, 07:42 PM:

The pub-sing aspect of TAIH has always been my favorite thing about the song. I've always subliminally heard the slurred drunk voices of revelers in those swooping intervals. And hearing it at baseball games provides the modern staging for the old context. :)

Gotta say the other thing I like about SSB (at least the one common verse) and TLIYL is that they don't mention god. God + state has never been a good combination to enshrine, at least not to my way of thinking.

Of course, we could also use "Louie Louie." Washington State considered it, but went with another Woody Guthrie song. So it's available...and festive...and you can be sure 90% of the population would accept whatever words you claimed as the actual lyrics. :)

rea ::: (view all by) ::: January 27, 2003, 08:08 PM:

"The third verse of the SSB puts me off:

'And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country should leave us no more!
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps' pollution.'"

Well, this is particularly ridiculous when you remember the less-than-glorious course of the military events that inspired the verse--British raiders captured Washington DC, burned the White House, etc., but by God, at least we were able to keep them out of Baltimore!