John Talbot

Notes:

2nd Earl of Shrewsbury. Chancellor of Ireland, 1446. Privy councillor, 1454. Lord High Treasurer, 1456-58. Master of the Falcons, 1457. Chief Butler of England, 1458. Chief Justice of Chester, 1459. Steward of the Town and Lordship of Ludlow, 1460.

Along with his brother Christopher Talbot, he was killed at the battle of Northampton, fighting on the Lancastrian side.

John married Elizabeth Butler before Mar 1445. Elizabeth (daughter of James le Boteler and Joan Beauchamp) was born on 21 Dec 1421; died on 8 Sep 1473; was buried in Shrewsbury Abbey, Shropshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

1. Gilbert Talbot was born in 1452 in of Grafton, Worcestershire, England; died on 16 Aug 1517; was buried in Whitchurch, Shropshire, England.

Notes:

"Old Talbot." Lord Strange of Blackmere. Count of Clermont, Marshal of France, Constable of Ireland, Privy councillor 1422 and 1443, Lord Justice of Ireland, and many other titles. Noted as the only Constable of France appointed by a king of England. Summoned to Parliament by writs, 26 Oct 1409 and after.

Created Earl of Shrewsbury 20 May 1442. Created Earl of Waterford 17 Jul 1446.

He was a major military commander of the Hundred Years' War, and was killed on the field at the Battle of Castillon, considered the last battle of that conflict. A monument to him was raised by the French generals who defeated him. His death in battle is portrayed in a painting by Charles-Philippe Larivière.

He spent four years a prisoner in France, after Joan of Arc stopped his string of successes there at the battle of Pattay, 1429.

He appears in Shakespeare's Henry IV, Part 1 as "valiant Lord Talbot, Earl of Shrewsbury, Created, for his rare success in arms."

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Abt 1361, of Blackmere, Whitchurch, Shropshire, England
• Alternate death: 8 Sep 1396, London, England
• Alternate death: 9 Sep 1396, London, England

Notes:

"Knighted by Richard II at his coronation, 16 July 1377. Served in Ireland 1380/1, against the Scots 1385, and again in Ireland 1394/5." [The Ancestry of Dorothea Poyntz, citation details below.]

Summoned to Parliament by writs dated 3 Mar 1384 to 17 Dec 1387.

Richard married Ankaret le Strange before 23 Aug 1383. Ankaret (daughter of John le Strange and Mary de Arundel) was born in 1361; died on 1 Jun 1413. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Between 1361 and 1362
• Alternate death: 23 May 1413

Notes:

Treasurer of War. Lord High Treasurer. Summoned to Parliament by writs dated 20 Aug 1383 to 9 Feb 1406. In 1404 he was one of 22 persons appointed by the king to his "continual council."

Thomas married Joan Furnival before 1 Jul 1379. Joan (daughter of William de Furnival and Thomasine) was born about Oct 1368; died in 1395; was buried in Worksop Priory, Nottinghamshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Abt 1332, of Eccleswall in Linton, Herefordshire, England

Notes:

He accompanied Edmund of Langley to Portugal, 1381-82, and John of Gaunt on his 1386-87 expedition to Spain, where he died of the pestilence.

Gilbert married Pernel le Boteler before 8 Sep 1352. Pernel (daughter of James le Boteler and Eleanor de Bohun) died in 1368. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Or Perina; or Butler.

John married Mary de Arundel before 1354. Mary (daughter of Edmund Fitz Alan and Alice de Warenne) died on 29 Aug 1396. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Also called Mary Fitz Alan.

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Abt 1331
• Alternate birth: Between 1337 and 1340

Notes:

"John (de Neville), Lord Neville, son and heir (a), had writs of livery of his father's lands in England and Scotland, after doing homage, October 1367. He was a captain under his father at the battle of Nevill's Cross, 17 October 1346, and was knighted about April 1360. His life of public service was as active as his father's. He served in Aquitaine, 1366 and the following years, and numerous commissions issued to him, December 1367 onwards. In 1368 (September, October) he was joint ambassador to France. K.G. 1369. In 1369 and 1371 trier of petitions in Parliament; Admiral of the North, July 1370, and in November following joint commissioner to treat with Genoa; steward of the King's household, 1372. In July 1372 he sailed for Brittany on an expedition protracted for want of reinforcements. He was then for several years engaged in Scotland and the Marches. In December 1377 he had a patent of the keepership of Bamburgh Castle for life; and in 1378 licence to castellate Raby and Sheriff Hutton in 1382. He was made keeper of Fronsac Castle, on the Dordogne, 3 June, and Seneschal of Gascony in June 1378. Returning to England, he became Warden of the Marches (as above), and in 1381 conservator of the peace, co. Durham and Sedbergh; joint commissioner to treat of peace with Scotland, May 1383 and March 1386/7. In July 1385 he was under orders to accompany the King to Scotland." [Complete Peerage]

"He was presumably of age when a recognizance was made to him in January 1351/2. His age of 40 and more at his mother's death on 13 Jan. 1373/4 supports this conclusion." [The Ancestry of Charles II, citation details below.]

John de Neville and Maud Percy were great-grandparents of Edward IV and Richard III, making them the most recent common ancestors of TNH and Elizabeth II:

John de Neville (1330-1388) = Maud Percy (d. 1379)
Ralph de Neville (1364-1425) = Joan Beaufort (1379-1440)
Cecily Neville (1415-1495) = Richard of York (1411-1460)
Edward IV (1442-1483) = Elizabeth Woodville (1437-1492)
Elizabeth of York (1466-1503) = Henry VII (1457-1509)
Margaret Tudor (1489)-1541) = James IV (1473-1513)
James V (1512-1542) = Mary of Guise (1515-1560)
Mary, Queen of Scots (1542-1587) = Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley (1545-1567)
James VI and I (1566-1625) = Anne of Denmark (1574-1619)
Elizabeth of Bohemia (1596-1662) = Frederick V of the Palatine (1596-1632)
Sophia of Hanover (1630-1714) = Ernest Augustus, Elector of Brunswick-Lüneberg (1629-1698)
George I (1660-1727) = Sophia Dorothea of Celle (1666-1726)
George II (1683-1760) = Caroline of Ansbach (1683-1737)
Frederick, Prince of Wales (1707-1751) = Augusta of Saxe-Gotha (1719-1772)
George III (1738-1820) = Charlotte of Mecklenburg (1744-1818)
Edward, Duke of Kent and Strathearn (1767-1820) = Victoria of Saxe-Coburg (1786-1861)
Victoria (1819-1901) = Albert of Saxe-Coburg (1819-1861)
Edward VII (1841-1910) = Alexandra of Denmark (1844-1925)
George V (1865-1936) = Mary of Teck (1867-1953)
George VI (1895-1952) = Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon (1900-2002)
Elizabeth II (1926- )

boldface: monarchs of England, Great Britain, or the United Kingdom
italic: monarchs of Scotland
boldface & italic: James IV and I, king of both

TNH is therefore 19th cousin once removed to Elizabeth II, no doubt sharing that distinction with literally hundreds of millions of other people.

John married Maud Percy before 1362. Maud (daughter of Henry de Percy and Idoine de Clifford) was born about 1345 in Alnwick, Northumberland, England; died before 18 Feb 1379; was buried in Durham Cathedral, Durham, Durham, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: 18 Feb 1379

Notes:

Richardson's RA has them married "before 1362." The Ancestry of Charles II says their marriage contract was dated July 1344.

Notes:

Summoned to Parliament by writs dated 20 Jan 1366 to 7 Jan 1383.

William married Thomasine between 1363 and 20 Jan 1366. Thomasine died on 20 Jul 1409. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Also called Thomasia.

Notes:

With his father, he took up arms against the king at Boroughbridge, 16 Mar 1322. He married Elizabeth Comyn clandestinely. He was summoned to Parliament 27 Jan 1332 by writ directed Ricardo Talbot. Against the king's orders, he joined Edward de Balliol in his August 1332 invasion of Scotland. In September 1334 he was taken prisoner by the Scots, but was ransomed and returned to England. On 21 Dec 1337 he was justiciar of the lands in Scotland occupied by the king of England. Steward of the King's Household, May 1345. He was with the king at Crécy and at the siege of Calais.

Richard married Elizabeth Comyn about 10 Jul 1326. Elizabeth (daughter of John Comyn and Joan de Valence) was born on 1 Nov 1299; died on 20 Nov 1372. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

During the reign of the Despensers, she was imprisoned by them for at least a year, and possibly two, in order to press her into granting them her property. After their fall in 1326, she successfully petitioned Edward III for the restitution of her lands.

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: 6 Jan 1338

Notes:

Earl of Ormond. Hereditary Chief Butler of Ireland, 1321-38.

James married Eleanor de Bohun in 1327. Eleanor (daughter of Humphrey de Bohun and Elizabeth of England) died on 7 Oct 1363. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 25 Jan 1306, of Blackmere, Whitchurch, Shropshire, England

Notes:

Also spelled Lestraunge. Summoned to Parliament by writ 23 Oct 1330 to 20 Apr 1344.

"John Lestrange, 2nd Lord (Baron) Strange (of Blackmere), JP (Salop 1332); fought at Crécy 1346; married as her 1st husband Ankaret (married 2nd Sir Thomas de Ferrers and died 8 Oct 1361), daughter of William Boteler, of Wem, Salop, and died 21 July 1349." [Burke's Peerage]

John married Ankaret le Boteler before 20 May 1327. Ankaret (daughter of William le Boteler and Ela de Herdeburgh) died on 8 Oct 1361. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

"Ankaret (married 2nd Sir Thomas de Ferrers and died 8 Oct 1361), daughter of William Boteler, of Wem, Salop." [Burke's Peerage]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 1 May 1285, Marlborough Castle, Wiltshire, England

Notes:

Also called Edmund Arundel. Earl of Arundel. An opponent of Gaveston, he became one of the Lords Ordainers, and one of those before whom Gaveston was tried before he was killed. Edmund Fitz Alan was also among the magnates who refused to help Edward II against Scotland, resulting in the disaster at Bannockburn. However, around the time his son Richard was betrothed to Hugh Dispenser the Younger's daughter Isabel, Fitz Alan began a rapprochement with the king. This would ultimately result in Fitz Alan's execution on the order of Roger Mortimer. According to a one account, a blunt sword was ordered, and his beheading took 22 strokes.

"Though he was never canonised, a cult emerged around the late earl in the 1390s, associating him with the 9th-century martyr king St Edmund. This veneration may have been inspired by a similar cult around his grandson, Richard Fitz Alan, 11th Earl of Arundel, who was executed by Richard II in 1397." [Wikipedia]

Just to drive home the point that association with the Despensers never works out for anybody, in 1344 his son Richard sought and obtained an anullment from his marriage to Isabel le Despenser, on the grounds that the betrothal had been inflicted on him in childhood and without his consent.

Edmund married Alice de Warenne after 30 Dec 1304. Alice (daughter of William de Warenne and Joan de Vere) died between 1330 and 23 May 1338. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

"Ralph (de Neville), Lord Neville, 2nd but 1st surviving son, was aged 40 and more at his father's death. He was taken prisoner with his younger brothers at Berwick in 1319. He had begun his long career of public service and official work already in 1322, when he was constable of Warkworth Castle, and serving in the Marches under the Earl of Carlisle. In 1324 he was appointed with the Earl of Angus to escort the envoys of Robert Bruce to York, to treat of peace, and in 1325 commissioner to keep the truce in Northumberland. At the time of his father's death he was already steward of the King's household. In the following January he indented to serve Sir Henry Percy, and in July was commissioned to take over the keepership of the Forest beyond Trent. He was present at the surrender of Berwick Castle to Edward III, July 1333, and again with the King in Scotland in 1334 (June-October) and in the summer of 1335; joint commissioner, 1333 and 1334, to Edward Baliol's Parliament, to demand confirmation of covenants, and in 1334 Warden of the Scottish Marches, some time sole and some time with Percy; in the same year chief of the justices in eyre of the Forest (Notts and Yorks) for that turn; in 1335 he was made keeper of Bamburgh Castle for life, and by Mar. 1336/7 was a banneret. In July 1338 and June 1340 he was appointed on the Council of Prince Edward as Keeper of the Realm, and (by the Bishop) overseer of the keepers of the temporalities of the see of Durham during his absence on the King's service. He commanded the first division at the victory of Durham, or Nevill's Cross, 17 October 1346, where King David of Scotland was taken prisoner; and took part in the naval success against the Spaniards off Winchelsea, 29 Aug. 1350." [Complete Peerage]

Unmentioned by CP, but he was educated at Oxford. He was the first layman to be buried at Durham Cathedral, in recognition of his role in the victory at Nevill's Cross.

Ralph married Alice de Audley after 14 Jan 1327. Alice (daughter of Hugh de Audley and Isolde le Rous) was born about 1300; died on 12 Jan 1374; was buried in Durham Cathedral, Durham, Durham, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 2 Feb 1300, Leconfield, Yorkshire, England
• Alternate birth: 6 Feb 1301, Leconfield, Yorkshire, England
• Alternate death: 27 Feb 1352, Warkworth, Northumberland, England

Notes:

Keeper of Berwick Castle; Keeper of the Coast of Yorkshire and Northumberland; Keeper of Bamburgh and Skipton Castles; Warden of the Scottish Marches; Justiciar of the East March.

M.P. 1322-52, according to Ancestral Roots.

Great-grandfather of Henry "Hotspur" Percy.

"A powerful border lord, he was a justiciar and warden of the Scottish marches, participated frequently in raids, skirmishes, battles and sieges against the Scots, including the battle of Neville's Cross, where he commanded a division." [The Ancestry of Charles II]

Henry married Idoine de Clifford about 1318. Idoine (daughter of Robert de Clifford and Maud de Clare) was born in of Appleby, Westmorland, England; died on 24 Aug 1365; was buried in Beverley Minster, Yorkshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Abt 1303, Clifford Castle, Herefordshire, England

Notes:

Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 11:11:50 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Looking for primary source documents on Idonia [Imania] de Clifford
Reply-To: Douglas Richardson

Dear Steve ~

The correct name of Henry de Percy's wife is Idoine de Clifford. "Idonia" or "Idonea" are the Latin forms of her name and should be avoided.

The parentage of Idoine de Clifford is hardly elusive as you imagine. There are no less than five separate visitations/medieval sources which name Idoine, wife of Sir Henry de Percy, as a Clifford, or the daughter of Lord Clifford:

1. Archaeologia Aeliana 3 (1844): 40 (Chronicles of Alnwick Abbey: "Iste Henricus disponsavit idoneam filiam Domini de Clyfford et genuit ex ea Anno Domini 1320 Henricum quartum et tertium Dominum de Alnewyk et alios plures filios et filias inter quos erat Thomas qui postea fuit Episcopus Norwicens ...").

2. Atkinson, Cartularium Abbathiæ de Whiteby 2 (Surtees Soc. 72) (1881): 690-696 (Percy ped.: "The fourth Henry Lord Percy ... gat on Idonea Clyfford Henry, William, Richard, Maude, Alianour Fitzwater, Roger, and Margarett that was maried to the Erle of Angus Sonne and his heire.").

3. Flower, Vis. of Yorkshire 1563-4 (H.S.P. 16) (1881): 241-244 (Percy ped.: "Henry 4 Lord Percy. = Ida doughter of the Lord Clyfford.").

This item is available online at the following weblink:

books.google.com/books?id=pjMEAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA242

4. Harvey et al., Vis. of the North 3 (Surtees Soc. 144) (1930): 18-20 (Percy ped.: "Henricus Percy = Idonea Clifforde").

This item is available online at the following weblink:

www.uiowa.edu/~c030149a/northern/surtees144text.pdf

5. Harvey et al., Vis. of the North 4 (Surtees Soc. 146) (1932): 17-24 (Lassels ped.: "Idonæ [Clifford] mar: to Henry lord Percy").

This item is available online at the following weblink:

www.uiowa.edu/~c030149a/northern/surtees146text.pdf

Given that we know that Sir Henry Percy was born in 1300 or 1301, and given that Henry's son and heir, also named Henry, was born about
1322-5, the birth of Idoine de Clifford would necessarily have to fall about 1300-1310. Given the chronology, Idoine de Clifford can be placed as a daughter of Robert de Clifford (died 1314), 1st Lord Clifford, and his wife, Maud de Clare, which Robert and Maud were married in 1295. Idoine de Clifford was surely named for her father's maternal aunt, Idoine de Vipont (died 1333), wife of Roger de Leybourne, Knt., and John de Cromwell, Knt., Lord Cromwell.

For interesting references to Idoine, wife of Sir Henry de Percy, see the following weblinks:

books.google.com/books?id=1MUwhOPhfKcC&pg=PA116&dq=Idoine+Percy

books.google.com/books?lr=&id=8AMhAAAAMAAJ&dq=Idoine+Percy&q=Idoine&pgis=1#search_anchor

books.google.com/books?id=RzUdAAAAIAAJ&q=Idoine+Percy&dq=Idoine+Percy&lr=&pgis=1

books.google.com/books?id=cu8i2yausLcC&pg=PA124&dq=Idoine+Percy&lr=

The tomb at Beverley Minster, Yorkshire which is now attributed to Idoine de Clifford, wife of Sir Henry de Percy, bears shields with various coats of arms, among them Clifford.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

On Wednesday, December 24, 2014 1:15:21 AM UTC-7, The Hoorn wrote:

So far, I have been unsuccessful in locating any primary or contemporaneous records, documenting the parentage of Idonia [Imania] de Clifford, as the daughter of Lord Robert Clifford (killed in battle Bannockburn 24 Jun 1314) and Matilda de Clare. Idonia was also the wife of Sir Henry Percy (1301-1352).

I would sincerely welcome any assistance.

Thanks!

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: 7 Oct 1339
• Alternate death: 14 Oct 1339

Notes:

Summoned to Parliament by writs dated 25 Aug 1318 to 25 Aug 1339.

Thomas married Joan de Verdun on 24 Feb 1318. Joan (daughter of Thebaud de Verdun and Maud de Mortimer) was born on 9 Aug 1303 in Wootton in Stanton Lacy, Shropshire, England; died on 2 Oct 1334 in Alton, Staffordshire, England; was buried in Croxden Abbey, Staffordshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 11 Aug 1303, Wootton in Stanton Lacy, Shropshire, England

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 1277

Notes:

"A knight when taking part in the tournament at Stepney, Feb 1309. On 16 Mar 1322, as a Knight Banneret, he was captured in arms against the King at the battle of Boroughbridge (Barons' Revolt). Knight of the Shire for Hereford, 1324; Justice of South Wales, 23 Oct 1330-24 Feb 1346." [The Ancestry of Dorothea Poyntz, citation details below.]

Gilbert married Anne le Boteler before 1306. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Fought the English at Falkirk and at Roslin. Like his father, he was nicknamed "Red" Comyn; also like his father, he was deeply involved in the factional fights that characterized Scottish political life in his day and age. He was stabbed to death by Robert de Brus (later Robert I, King of Scots) and his followers in the Church of Friars Minors in Dumfries, allegedly because he opposed Brus's plan for insurrection.

John married Joan de Valence before 3 Sep 1296. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Between 1273 and 1279, of Knocktopher, Kilkenney, Ireland

Notes:

Justiciar of Ireland. In 1316-17 he commanded the English forces in Ireland against the invasion of Edward de Brus. He died in London after returning from a pilgrimage to Santiago de Compostello.

Edmund married Joan fitz John in 1302. Joan (daughter of John fitz Thomas fitz Gerald and Blanche Roche) died before 2 May 1320. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Also called Joan Fitzgerald.

Notes:

"He supported the rebellious Thomas, Earl of Lancaster, and was killed at the battle of Boroughbridge, in Yorkshire, 16 Mar 1322 when endeavoring to force the bridge. He was buried in the Church of the Friars Preachers, York. At the siege of Caerlaverock, July 1300; knighted with Edward, Prince of Wales, at Westminster 22 May 1306, in preparation for an expedition into Scotland; fought at the battle of Bannockburn (English-Scottish Wars), 24 June 1314." [The Ancestry of Dorothea Poyntz, citation details below.]

Humphrey married Elizabeth of England on 14 Nov 1302 in Westminster Abbey, Westminster, Middlesex, England. Elizabeth (daughter of Edward I, King of England and Eleanor of Castile, Queen Consort of England) was born on 7 Aug 1282 in Rhuddlan Castle, Flintshire, Wales; died on 5 May 1316 in Quendon, Essex, England; was buried in Walden Abbey, Essex, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: Bef 24 Jan 1324
• Alternate death: 1 Feb 1324
• Alternate death: 23 Jan 1325

Notes:

Seneschal of Aquitaine, 26 May 1322. Field commander for Edwards I and II in Scotland and France. Summoned to Parliament by writ 4 Mar 1309.

"Fulk Lestrange, 1st Lord (Baron) Strange (of Blackmere), so created by writ of summons to Parliament 4 March 1308/9; served in Edward I's and Edward II's Scottish campaigns 1298-1323; Seneschal of Aquitaine 1322; married Eleanor (predeceased her husband), daughter of John Giffard, of Brimsfield, Glos. 1st Lord (Baron) Giffard, and died by 23 Jan 1323/4." [Burke's Peerage]

Fulke married Eleanor Giffard before 1301. Eleanor (daughter of John Giffard and Maud de Clifford) was born in 1275 in of Brimpsfield, Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England; died before 23 Jan 1324. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: Bef 1325

Notes:

Eleanor (predeceased her husband), daughter of John Giffard, of Brimsfield, Glos. 1st Lord (Baron) Giffard. [Burke's Peerage]

Notes:

Also spelled Le Botiller. "Her served as a Justce of Assize, a Conservator of the Peace, and Commander of levies, in addition to being an MP." [Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell, citation details below.]

"William le Botiler of Wem and Oversley, next brother and heir, born 11 June 1274. He had livery of his brother's lands 8 April 1296, and having served in the wars with Scotland, was summoned to Parliament 10 March 1307/8 to 10 October 1325, by writs directed Willelmo le Botiller (or sometimes le Butiller) de Wemme, whereby he be held to have become Lord le Botiller. He m. 1stly, before 1298, Beatrice, who was living in 1305-06. He m., 2ndly, before February 1315/6, Ela daughter and coheir of Roger of Herdeburgh. He d. 1334, before 14 September. His widow was living 5 July 1343, and d. s.p.m." [Complete Peerage II:232]

William married Ela de Herdeburgh before 1310. Ela (daughter of Roger de Herdeburgh and Ida de Odingsells) died after 5 Jul 1343. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Also called Richard de Arundel. Earl of Arundel.

From Complete Peerage, 1:240-41:

Richard fitz Alan, feudal Lord of Clun and Oswestry and [according to the admission of 1443], Earl of Arundel, only son and heir, born 3 February 1266/7, and was only 5 years old at his father's death. He had seizin of his lands 8 December 1287. According to Glover he was created Earl of Sussex (a) in 1289, when he was knighted and "received the sword of the county of Sussex" from Edward I "ut vocatur Comes;", but it seems more probable that this creation was as Earl of Arundel (b). At all events no more is heard of the former title (Sussex) as connected with this family, but only of the title of Arundel. On 12 February 1290/1 there is a grant to him as Richard Arundel, Earl of Arundel. In October 1292 he was summoned by a writ directed to the Earl of Arundel, and was summoned to Parliament 24 June 1295, by a writ directed Ricardo filio Alani Comiti Arundell, ranking him as junior to all the other Earls. He fought in the Welsh wars 1288, in Gascony 1295-7, and in the Scottish wars 1298-1300, being present at the siege of Carlaverock in 1300. He signed the Barons' letter to the Pope, 12 February 1300/1.

(a) "The Earldom of Sussex must at this period have been a subject of contention between the De Warrens and Fitz Alans, for John de Warren, Earl of Surrey, was receiving, at the very time that this investiture occurred, writs directed to him as Earl of Sussex. John de Warren was perhaps the greatest noble of the time in which he lived, and his power and influence may have operated to induce Fitz Alan to abandon his claim upon the Earldom of Sussex and to adopt that [i.e. the Earldom of Arundel] by which his descendants have ever since been known." (Courthope, p. 29).

(b) It is worthy of remark, in connection with the very doubtful right, either of his father or grandfather, to the Earldom of Arundel, that it was not till 1282, viz. sometime after their death and during this Earl's minority, that Isabel, Countess of Arundel, widow of Hugh (d'Aubigny), died. It would almost appear (possibly owing to the largess of her dower) that the Earldom was not dealt with during her lifetime. A somewhat parallel case occurs, later on, in the same family, when Richard, Earl of Arundel, who, in 1347, had suc. his maternal uncle the Earl of Surrey, did not assume the Earldom of Surrey till the death of Joan, widow of the afsd. Earl, in 1361.

Richard married Alice di Saluzzo in Nov 1282. Alice (daughter of Tomasso di Saluzzo and Aluigia del Vasto) was born in of Saluzzo, Cuneo, Piedmont, Italy; died on 25 Sep 1292; was buried in Haughmond Abbey, Shropshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Also called Alasia di Saluzzo; Alasia del Vasto di Saluzzo.

"Along with her aunt Alasia de Saluzzo who married Edmund de Lacy, 2nd earl of Lincoln, in 1247, Alasia was one of the first Italian women to marry into an English noble family. Her marriage had been arranged by the late King Henry III's widowed queen consort Eleanor de Provence." [Leo van de Pas]

CP has her buried at Todingham Priory, but Chris Phillips's compilation of corrections to CP includes Douglas Richardson's note in Jan 2002 that "the bodies of both Richard and Alesia were at Haughmond Abbey, Shropshire, by 1341, when provision was made for 12 candles to burn in the church of Haughmond around their tombs."

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 15 Jan 1256, of Bromfield, Denbighshire, Wales
• Alternate death: 15 Dec 1286, Croydon, Surrey, England

Notes:

Killed at a tournament; said to have been ambushed and slain by rivals.

William married Joan de Vere in 1284. Joan (daughter of Robert de Vere and Alice de Sanford) died about 23 Nov 1293; was buried in Lewes Priory, Sussex, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: Bef 24 Nov 1293

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: 18 Apr 1331

Notes:

"Randolf or Ranulph (sometimes called, seemingly in error, Ralph, son and heir of Robert de Neville and Mary his wife, was born 18 October 1262, and was heir to the Neville estates on the death of his grandfather, in 1282 (having livery under writ of 11 January 1283/4), and to his mother's inheritance, April 1320. He was summoned, 15 July 1287, with horses and arms to a military council at Gloucester (before Edmund, Earl of Cornwall, in the King's absence abroad), and to attend the King at Westminster, June 1294. He was summoned to Parliament from 24 June 1295 to 18 February 1330/1, by writs directed Ranulpho (and Radulpho) de Neville, whereby he is held to have become Lord Neville. For service in Scotland he was summoned 1291 and in later years; for service in Gascony, 1294, 1297 and 1324; and against the rebels under the Earl of Lancaster, 1322. His seal, as Dominus de Raby, was attached to the letter of the Barons to the Pope, February 1300/1. In 1303 he was chief of the delegates summoned by the King to set forth the grievances of the people against the Bishop of Durham. He, or possibly his son Ralph, was commissioner of array in Durham, 1322, in the North Riding of Yorks, 1324, and in Northumberland, 1324 and 1326; in 1325 Keeper of the Peace and one of the specially appointed keepers of the coast in Northumberland, and in 1326 one of the commissioners to impress shipping in the ports of that county. He m., 1stly, Eupheme, daughter of Robert Fitzroger, Lord Fitzroger (see Clavering), and, 2ndly, Margery, dau. of John de Thweng, by whom he had no issue. He died shortly after 18 April 1331." [Complete Peerage IX:497-8.]

Dugdale says of him that "It is reported of this Ranulph, that he little minded Secular business; but, for the most part, betook himself to conversation with the Canons of Merton and Coverham; as also, that he committed Incest with his own Daughter, and that Richard de Kellaw, Bishop of Durham, did for that crime compel him to do publick pennance." According to footnote (b) of the CP account quoted previously, this took place in 1313.

A slightly different version of the incest story is found in the 1875 Preface to Volume III of The Register of Richard de Kellawe, Lord Palatine and Bishop of Durham, 1314-1316, by the volume's editor, Sir Thomas Duffus Hardy. Hardy devotes nearly a page to the conviction and punishment of Ranulph's daughter Anastasia for her adultery with John de Lilleford, dwelling at length on how "proving contumacious, sentence of the Greater Excommunication was pronounced against her." This sentence was subquently commuted by the bishop and replaced with six weeks of elaborate public penance. But "[t]his unhappy woman's troubles seem not to have ended even with this promulgation of her shame and disgrace. On the 9th of November following, a mandate was issued by the bishop for the condemnation of Sur Ranulph de Neville, knight, who had been 'judicially convicted of the crime of incest and adultery with the said Anastasia, his daughter, and wife of Sir Walter de Fauconberg;' to appear in the parish church of Aukland, on the Monday after the feast of St. Andrew the Apostle, there to receive penance for the said crime and for the further offence of contumacy. Sir Ranulph failing to appear, on the 16th of the following month, a mandate was issued, directing him to be excommunicated, in the Galilee at Durham, and all parish churches within the archdeaconry of Durham. We have no further details of this lamentable story. Sir Ranulph de Nevill, of Raby, was a baron of Parliament by writ, succeeded his grandfather Robert, in 1282, and died in 1331. It is only just to add, that Sir Ranulph seems habitually to have been in disfavour with the church; as for other, and apparently, trivial offenses, he had been pronounced excommunicated in the month of August before; but on the Tuesday after Michaelmas day had been absolved. On the 13th of October following, we find him again cited, 'for certain crimes and excesses which he has confessed,' to appear before the bishop or his commissaries, in the Galilee at Durham. In this instance, the nature of his offenses is not named."

There certainly seems to have been no love lost between the Neville family and the Durham ecclesiastical establishment. Dugdale reports that shortly after Ranulph assumed his inheritance in 1282, he had a feud with the prior of Durham over the terms of a customary presentation of a stag to the priory on St. Cuthbert's Day. And we see from his CP entry that in 1303 "Ranulph was chief of the delegates summoned by the King to set forth the grievances of the people against the Bishop of Durham." The incest case happened in 1313. In 1318, Ranulph's eldest son Robert attacked and killed Richard Marmaduke, seneschal to the bishop, on the Old Bridge of Durham. All of which suggests a cycle of offense and reprisal. (Later in the same year, Robert was killed by James, earl of Douglas, in single combat to which Robert had dared the earl.)

It should also be noted that Dugdale's characterization of Ranulph as "little minding Secular business" accords oddly with the eventful life of military and civilian service set forth by Complete Peerage. And yet this characterization appears elsewhere. T. F. Bulmer's 1890 History and Directory of Old Yorkshire states that this Ranulph "was so indolent and careless in the management of his affairs, that his mother settled Middleham and the rest of her manors on her grandson, Robert Neville". One wonders if we aren't simply picking through the tattered leavings of a 700-years-gone propaganda war.

Ranulph married Euphemia de Clavering before 12 Mar 1281. Euphemia (daughter of Robert fitz Roger and Margaret la Zouche) was born after 1265; died about 1320; was buried in Staindrop, Durham, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: 1 Apr 1325, Wallingford Castle, Oxfordshire, England
• Alternate death: Bef 12 Apr 1326

Notes:

Summoned to Parliament by writ, 1321. Joined the rebellion of Thomas, Earl of Lancaster in 1322, but surrendered before the battle of Boroughbridge. Died while a prisoner in Wallingford Castle.

"Hugh Audley, of Stratton Audley, Oxon, yst. s. of James Audley or Aldithley, of Heleigh, co. Stafford by Ela, da. of William Longespée (s. and h. ap. of Ela, suo jure Countess of Salisbury); was b. c. 1267, and obtained from his mother, soon after her husband's death, a reversionary grant, (1272-73) 1 Edw. I, of Stratton Audley, afsd., which had been her inheritance. He was in the French wars, 1294, &c.; a prisoner in France 2 Apr. 1299; in the Scottish wars, 1299-1302, and again 1313; he was in Gascony in 1304/5; Justice of North Wales 1306; and was Governor of Montgomery Castle, 1309. He was sum. to Parl. 15 May (1321) 14 Edw. II, the writ being directed Hugoni de Audele seniori, to distinguish him from his 2nd s., Hugh Audley, Junior, who had been so sum. in 1317. In 1321/2 he joined the insurrection of the Earl of Lancaster, but surrendered before the battle of Boroughbridge, 16 Mar. 1321/2, and was confined in Wallingford Castle. He m., before 7 Jan. 1293, and probably in 1288, Isolt, widow of Sir Walter de Balun, of Much Marcle, co. Hereford (who was living and m. to her in 1286/7), da. of Sir Edmund de Mortimer, 1st Lord Mortimer, of Wigmore, co. Hereford, by (____). She brought him the manors of Eastington, co. Gloucester, and of Thornbury, Co. Hereford. He d. between Nov. 1325, and Mar. 1325/6, probably while still a prisoner. No trace can be found of the pardon which he is sometimes said to have received, and any peerage which he may be held to have possessed, may be treated as having been forfeited by attainder. His widow was living 1336." [Complete Peerage I:347-48, as corrected in Volume XIV. See the entry on his wife for doubt she was was a daughter of Edmund de Mortimer.]

Hugh married Isolde le Rous before Jul 1291. Isolde (daughter of Roger le Rous and Eleanor de Avenbury) died before 4 Aug 1338. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Complete Peerage and Ancestral Roots give her as a daughter of Sir Edmund Mortimer, 7th Baron Mortimer of Wigmore, by an unidentified first wife, but various discussions on SGM and elsewere led to a consensus that this is chronologically improbable and that her parentage must be regarded as unknown. See also this page on Chris Phillips' site.

More recently, on 17 Dec 2017, Douglas Richardson posted to SGM evidence that she was a daughter of Roger le Rous and his wife Eleanor de Avenbury. Both pieces of evidence have to do with the known fact that her first husband was Walter de Balun, who died in 1287. In 1296 one Isolde sued Reynold de Balun in the Court of Common Pleas regarding the manor of Eastington, Gloucester, which she claimed as her right and which she was in fact holding at that time. Reynold de Balun was Walter de Balun's brother and heir. The record identifies Isolde, the plaintiff, as "daughter of Roger le Rus." The other document is a record of Walter de Balun and his wife, Isolde, being enfeoffed with the manor of Much Marcle, Herefordshire by Roger le Rous. Between these two it seems clear that the wife of Hugh de Audley, widow of Walter de Balun, was a daughter of Roger le Rous.

Complete Peerage and Ancestral Roots give her as a daughter of Sir Edmund Mortimer, 7th Baron Mortimer of Wigmore, by an unidentified first wife, but various discussions on SGM and elsewere led to a consensus that this is chronologically improbable and that her parentage must be regarded as unknown. See also this page on Chris Phillips' site.

More recently, on 17 Dec 2017, Douglas Richardson posted to SGM evidence that she was a daughter of Roger le Rous and his wife Eleanor de Avenbury. Both pieces of evidence have to do with the known fact that her first husband was Walter de Balun, who died in 1287. In 1296 one Isolde sued Reynold de Balun in the Court of Common Pleas regarding the manor of Eastington, Gloucester, which she claimed as her right and which she was in fact holding at that time. Reynold de Balun was Walter de Balun's nephew and heir. The record identifies Isolde, the plaintiff, as "daughter of Roger le Rus." The other document is a record of Walter de Balun and his wife, Isolde, being enfeoffed with the manor of Much Marcle, Herefordshire by Roger le Rous. Between these two it seems clear that the wife of Hugh de Audley, widow of Walter de Balun, was a daughter of Roger le Rous.

Notes:

Warden of Galloway and Ayrshire 1296; Justiciar in Dumfries and joint Justiciar in Lancaster, Cumberland, and Westmorland 1297; constable of Scarborough Castle 1308; Justice of the Forest Beyond Trent 1311; Keeper of Bamburgh Castle 1313; Keeper of the Marches.

M.P. 1299-1314, according to Ancestral Roots.

Fought at Bannockburn.

Henry married Eleanor de Arundel. Eleanor (daughter of Richard Fitz Alan and Alice di Saluzzo) was born about 1284 in Arundel, Sussex, England; died in 1328; was buried in Beverley, Yorkshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: 14 Apr 1274
• Alternate birth: Abt 5 Apr 1276, of Appleby, Westmorland, England

Notes:

Served in Edward I's wars in Scotland. On the death of his mother, he succeeded to the hereditary shrievalty of Westmorland. Justice in Eyre North of Trent 1297-1307. Governor of Nottingham Castle, July 1298. Summoned to Parliament 29 Dec 1299 to 26 Nov 1313 by writs directed Roberto de Clifford. Signed the 1301 Barons' Letter to Pope Boniface VIII as Robertus de Clifford Castellanus de Appelby. By Edward II he was made, for a few months in 1308, Marshal of England; Justice South of Trent 1307-8; Warden of the Scottish Marches 1308. Pardoned 16 Oct 1313 for participation in the death of Piers Gaveston. Killed at the Battle of Bannockburn.

Robert married Maud de Clare on 13 Nov 1295. Maud (daughter of Thomas de Clare and Juliane fitz Maurice) died on 1 Feb 1325. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: Between 4 Mar 1327 and 24 May 1327

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate birth: Bef 1270, of Sheffield, Yorkshire, England

Notes:

He was summoned to Parliament from 24 June 1295 to 27 Jan 1332 by writs directed Thome de Furnivall. He took part in the siege of Caerlaverock, 1300.

Thomas married Joan le Despenser after 13 Jan 1273. Joan (daughter of Hugh le Despenser and Aline Basset) died before 8 Jun 1322. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Notes:

Fought at Falkirk. Justiciar of Ireland, 30 Apr 1313 - Jan 1315. He was summoned to Parliament by writs from 29 Dec 1299 to 16 Oct 1315.

Thebaud married Maud de Mortimer on 29 Jul 1302 in Wigmore, Herefordshire, England. Maud (daughter of Edmund de Mortimer and Margaret de Fiennes) died on 17 Sep 1312 in Alton, Staffordshire, England; was buried in Croxden Abbey, Staffordshire, England. [Group Sheet] [Family Chart]

Other Events and Attributes:

• Alternate death: 18 Sep 1312, Alton, Staffordshire, England